I hope you are right, I really do, and at CSU he even had an up-tempo offense. I dream that is what we have. I hope we have another great year and Nuss gets hired away and we get an elite recruiting OC. I am just skeptical after F$U and MeatChicken
Ok, so now that the nonsense sports are out of the way, let's focus on the SEC East...
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I hope you are right, I really do, and at CSU he even had an up-tempo offense. I dream that is what we have. I hope we have another great year and Nuss gets hired away and we get an elite recruiting OC. I am just skeptical after F$U and MeatChicken
I atill have faith brother, just worried about the talent gap being created. I don't care who the QB was, absolutely NO excuse for that bowl game, that was flat out humiliating
oH.
It sounded to me like you were attempting to construct a bit of a straw man. That you took the criticisms by Gators fans of Butch at face value. You then constructed a scenario that if Butch beats Mac, then those same criticisms MUST apply to Mac.
That is what it sounded like you were doing. So I demonstrated that "logic" is a bit on the faulty side, using your coach and Paul Johnson to construct the same straw man.
Like I said, no lucid discussions will come from FSU fans.
You need to move on if all you are going to do is criticize our coach. You may do that all you want on that cesspool of a site your fans run.
But you are not going to do it here.
I dunno...maybe you know better than me, but this is your OC's offense at Washington and it sure doesn't resemble anything that Bama does.
You have been threatening me for a while. You should cry less and enjoy life more.
So Mark Richt is a better coach than McElwain, right? And Barry Switzer was a better coach than Steve Spurrier, right? And Jimbo Fisher is a better coach than Gary Patterson, right? If you want to make it about winning divisions and titles that's fine, but apply it across the board. Earlier in this post people were pointing out Butch Jones' failure vs. ranked opponents: 3-18 (.167). Do you know McElwain's record vs. ranked opponents? It's 1-7 (.125). "But that's different". Of course it is. It's always different when the criteria is turned around on your guy.
Let's see what Florida looks like heading into year 4, then we can compare. But he's right, one has been to Atlanta the other has not.....Right? By the way, check out last years AP poll, see Ole Miss and UTenn there?
UT was unranked when you played them. Feel free to go back and adjust Jones' record as well though if you would like to use that criteria.
Also, 2012 Utah State and 2014 Boise State both finished ranked so be sure to add those 2 losses if you want to use final rankings.
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Well, I meant that Eason, as a true frosh, would really struggle, but it's not rocket science to realize that a guy with no experience will have a learning curve.
Why don't we use the final coaches poll? How about we use the pre-season polls? The point being,is that one has won the east after just 1 season and the other has not in 3 attempts. We could also point out that one is 1-0 and the other is 0-1 in head to head match-ups. If after 3 seasons if Mac has a similar horrible record, he will be gone too. Now, you get the point, right?
Jesus Christ, man. You and Paco. A previous poster used record vs. ranked opponents to criticize Butch Jones. I was just pointing out that the same standard could be applied to your coach (and it's not pretty). All of the criticisms you guys hurl at Butch Jones, Mark Richt, & Jimbo Fisher can easily be turned around on McElwain. Don't think that the irony of you guys bashing Fisher for "not being able to win without Winston" and then making excuse after excuse for McElwain's record after losing Grier is lost on me.
I will defend both sides:
1. McElwain is un-criticizable. Everything he does is perfect or there is some lame excuse why.
BUT
The dude did win 10 games taking over for the worst coach in NCAA history
Damn, I didn't mean to hurt your little feelings....I knew you guys weren't too bright, but sensitive too....trying to point out that the same standard could be used after 1 season at Florida was absolutely silly and stupid. Sure, use his record at CSU if you want, but they aren't exactly big boy football, now are they? Why don't we do this, have Winston get suspended half way through the season for some reason, any reason, say, like rape, and then replace him with Treon. After that then we can discuss the meaning of irony. As I said above, lets see what this thing looks like after year 3....if it is Butch Jonesesque, then he should be gone. I am very concerned about the recruiting...something Butch, Marky and Dumbo have done well....
Mcelwain was in his first year though with many problems and Butch is not and has lost to our last two coaches and Muschamp twice... his program should be ahead and it hasn't been and his record against ranked teams reflects that...
Mac inherited an 8-5 team (officially 7-5 due to the Idaho game) with 5 future 1st rounders starting on defense. I definitely don't agree with your assessment that he inherited as many problems as what was at UT. UF under Muschamp (.571) was clearly better than UT under Dooley (.417). Jones has lost some big games that he could have easily won though. No doubt about that. That's fair criticism.
Move along, youngster. That was not a threat. That was more of an attempt to police the board a bit.
Looking at Richt's career to date compared to to mac's career to date? Of course Richt's career is better.
But that is not what you were trying to do. I am not quite sure what you wre trying to do. I am not sure you know what you were trying to do. You got caught in a straw man and now you are flailing about, trying to support a position sinking in the sand.
To wit:
What?
What?
Indeed. That was my point with using your "logic" with Fisher.
Good to know. Because Paco has previously stated that McElwain is a superior coach to Richt and Fisher. Glad that you disagree with him.
No doubt in my mind that Mac is a damn good "coach". The question is can he become the entire package to become elite like Saban, Meyer, etc. imo, Richt was good at the extras but was not a great "coach". I think Fisher can recruit and coach offense but he seems to lack the 'it' factor when it comes to choosing assistants. So much goes into being elite like Saban, Meyer and co. I mean their is a reason they own 7 of the last 10 NCs. Problem is we all want to have a Saban or Meyer, but they are hard to find.
Correct, which gets back to the heart of the argument. People will cherry pick the criteria to fit their narrative. McElwain is better than Jones because he's won a divisional title, but Barry Switzer is not better than Spurrier because he won more titles. When the criteria supports the correct narrative it's valid and when it contradicts the narrative it's not.
I do. On both counts. But I reserve the right to change my mind, as new observation points come available.***
****edit....Went back and reread all of Paco's posts in this thread. I could be wrong, but nowhere in this thread did he claim Mac was a better coach than Fisher or Richt? All I read in this thread was that he wrote that Mac was a better coach than Jones.
So, if I am right, once again you construct a straw man to support an untenable position. I except no lucid comments from you on the matter.
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I think Fisher is a very average to poor game day coach. I am not even sure he always puts a great game plan together. There are too many games where he just gets out game planned and out game managed by inferior, or roughly equal teams and coaches.
So Paco has never posted outside of this thread regarding Fisher or Richt? Also, you seem to contradict yourself in the very next post.
People (including every single criminole ever born), will cherry pick the criteria to fit their narrative. Of course wins vs the Cupcake Conf. (jimblow) always count more than any SEC wins. 
But Barry Switzer is not better than Spurrier because he won more titles.
And how many of Barry's titles came in the best conference (SEC) in the nation?
How many BCS-NC's did ACC teams win, all both of them (FSUcks & scUM)?
Of course, crims will tell you that a season long schedule vs SEC teams is no more difficult than an ACC schedule, and that why Saint Blobby Bowdown shied away to join the Cupcakes....
BTW, the Retch is also 0-1 vs McElwain (27-3), and he supposedly had the much better team.
When was the last time that a crim-coach was predicted to have 7 wins at best, but ended up with 10 wins and their division (7-1) championship?
(just paddlin' the ole K-new....)
But Barry Switzer is not better than Spurrier because he won more titles.
And how many of Barry's titles came in the best conference (SEC) in the nation?
How many BCS-NC's did ACC teams win, all both of them (FSUcks & scUM)?
Of course, crims will tell you that a season long schedule vs SEC teams is no more difficult than an ACC schedule, and that why Saint Blobby Bowdown shied away to join the Cupcakes....
BTW, the Retch is also 0-1 vs McElwain (27-3), and he supposedly had the much better team.
When was the last time that a crim-coach was predicted to have 7 wins at best, but ended up with 10 wins and their division (7-1) championship?
(just paddlin' the ole K-new....)
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what was his record with a good defense and a good QB in his first year before rock skipper came around? He was up for coach of the year in the entire nation......If he has a QB that can complete a screen in year two what could happen? If we had a QB that could throw it 2 yards we not only wouldn't have gotten embarrassed the last 3 games but the FSU game was a sure fire win with all the wide open guys and against a team that would have never scored on our defense coming from behind because the game was just like the 2011 game. FSU wasn't ever gonna do anything forced to open it up against what our defense was doing to them and whoever scored first you get what you saw. Of course people are too stupid to see that, Calloway was so open for a TD in the first quarter of that game it would have put FSU up shits creek right then trying to open it up and come back. We thought driskel was bad lol, we had one on the same roster just as awful and maybe even worse .
Sounds like you're saying that 4 loss McElwain can't win without Grier. I mean isn't that the game you, Paco, MJ, etc. play?
That was last year, but even with the FSUcks 'joke' flip at QB, Mc still went 4-4, mostly with the defense and the running game.
I don't recall saying Mac was a better coach than Fisher or Richt. I've never once compared the 3 of them. You've got the wrong guy.
In fact of course Richt has had a better coaching career than McElwain. He's been a head coach much longer.
So try to pin your crap on somebody else
I've never ever said anything of the sort. Not on this thread or any others. He's full of shit. Try to pin it on somebody else SKSnole.
So are you saying that you've never called Fisher an average coach or are you saying that McElwain is a below average to average coach?
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