I think it's really interesting how our societal values are dictated by everybody's perception of what outrages everybody else, when really, if you polled people individually, nobody really cares that much.
Will Urban Meyer be tOSU coach much longer?
- Thread starter GADAWGinIraq
- Start date
I think it's really interesting how our societal values are dictated by everybody's perception of what outrages everybody else, when really, if you polled people individually, nobody really cares that much.
Yeah. It's not like Urb is an innocent victim. On the other hand, the "outrage" is probably mostly media-driven. People don't really care that much.
Paul Finebaum is on first take right now torching Urban Meyer
"Meyer left that program in ashes (UF).....just ask Will Muschamp in private what he inherited down there"
Finebaum taking no prisoners taking shots at everyone
"The media is scared of Urban Meyer. It took someone fired from this network, from ESPN, to break this story. That may not be real popular to say on here right now, but it is what is"
"Meyer left that program in ashes (UF).....just ask Will Muschamp in private what he inherited down there"
Finebaum taking no prisoners taking shots at everyone
"The media is scared of Urban Meyer. It took someone fired from this network, from ESPN, to break this story. That may not be real popular to say on here right now, but it is what is"
Supposedly, Meyer's contract contains a clause compelling him to report evidence or allegations of domestic abuse by his players or staff to the Administration. I haven't looked at the contract, but if this is true, and If he knowingly didn't report allegations, then he could theoretically be fired for cause.
Rumor has it that after the 2009 incident, Meyer pressured the wife into not pressing charges. That's the kind of stuff that football coaches could get away with in 2009 that they can't in 2018.
I love this quote from Urb's press conference last week:
"So I know nothing about it. I asked people back at the office to call and see what happened, and they came back and said they know nothing.”
Talk about due diligence! Way to dig in there Urb!
Here's another lol from the article:
In the Woody Hayes Athletic Complex, emblazoned on the wall, are Meyer’s five core values. Among the five – in ALL CAPS – is “TREAT WOMEN WITH RESPECT”
Urb is some special kind of sociopath.
"So I know nothing about it. I asked people back at the office to call and see what happened, and they came back and said they know nothing.”
Talk about due diligence! Way to dig in there Urb!
Here's another lol from the article:
In the Woody Hayes Athletic Complex, emblazoned on the wall, are Meyer’s five core values. Among the five – in ALL CAPS – is “TREAT WOMEN WITH RESPECT”
Urb is some special kind of sociopath.
It really IS pretty amazing that McMurphy was able to break this story via Facebook.
Social media and world of reporting is so different now than it was only a few years ago.
He’s gotta be like, “Suck it ESPN...”
Basically.
Where are we as a society when a man is supposed to get scorched publicly because he ‘might’ have known some other guy was abusing his wife? It’s completely retarded. Even if he knew. He’s not law enforcement. The university definitely knew and didn’t do a damn thing but he’s the well known figure so by golly let’s hang him even when people all around him failed. The chicks own parents encouraged her to stay in the marriage. There are so many effed up things that happened here but everybody is being told that Urban Meyer is the issue so he gets the hanging. Whatever.
Shouldn’t Zach Smith be the guy getting the grilling? Its almost as if the attention has been taken off of him.
Where are we as a society when the football coach of a major public university puts the employment of a favored assistant over the welfare of a young woman he knows is being abused?
It works both ways oozie.
It works both ways oozie.
It 100% has been taken off him. He’s getting no air time at all. Everyone is going after Meyer...ask yourself why. People can’t avoid being part of the frenzy long enough to think. Listening to the media you’d think Meyer was the one putting hands on her if you didn’t know any better.
I agree this is a career ender for him but again everybody is talking about Meyer.
Uh the people who were accountable for her welfare failed. Including herself. That won’t be popular either but she’s an adult, I don’t give a damn if she was talked into one time from not pressing charges if she was being abused for years and stayed she bares some responsibility for her own well being, not to mention putting her own kids in harms way by staying. Her own damn parents encouraged her to stay. She called the police multiple other times and then when officers showed up declined to press charges. Why is Urban Meyer responsible for her welfare again knowing all that? People are outraged for the sake of being outraged. Meyer is getting the press because he’s the public figure, plenty of people failed including those who should have protected her most.
Nobody is deflecting away from Zach Smith.
The story...and it is a legitimate one...is about a coach who values winning football games above everything else. It isn’t a frenzy...it is real.
We have heard this type of crap about Urban going all the way back to his time at Florida, and many of us (including sadgator) have refused to take an honest look at who Urban really is. We can’t deny what is becoming apparently obvious now.
The story...and it is a legitimate one...is about a coach who values winning football games above everything else. It isn’t a frenzy...it is real.
We have heard this type of crap about Urban going all the way back to his time at Florida, and many of us (including sadgator) have refused to take an honest look at who Urban really is. We can’t deny what is becoming apparently obvious now.
You just can’t blame a 20 something year old girl with all that was at stake...you just can’t...
Urban is a grown man. When you reach that level and are in that place of authority, more is expected of you. Fair or not, you have a tremendous responsibility. It looks very much like Urban didn’t do the right thing here.
Ok so now we’ve reached the point where women are too dumb and weak to make choices on their own. Is that it? Not saying you’re saying that obviously, but that’s the tune people have to sing to justify the failure from everyone around her to focus on Urban. This isn’t a one man thing.
Except you don't actually know that Meyer knew anything. It's not a fact yet.
Now I'm not a head in the sand guy - it does sound credible but this is a major concern with the rush to judgement here. People want this guy fired for rumors and jumps in logic.
Just wait a bit for the facts and then he can be roasted.
Agree you can't blame the girl. She's in an impossible situation there. He's making all the money and there are kids involved. It's a very tough decision to separate kids from their dad, and it could be difficult legally.
It's a little murkier as far as what Urb should have done. It sounds like he did talk to Smith. I would imagine he told him to knock off whatever was happening. He could have fired him, obviously. But he might legitimately question whether that's better for the family for the guy to be out a $300k a year job. Beyond that, what's he supposed to do?
It's really just an impossible situation for everyone, created by Smith, who is filth. But focusing all the blame on Meyer and getting him fired lets the mob feel like the impossible problem has been solved and calms everyone's collective outrage.
I understand what you are saying, Oozie. And I do honestly sometimes wonder about the apparent discrepancy between "women are equal" but they "also need special protection." But, that's not really the issue here.
Urban is the face of OSU football. Part of his job, aside from winning football games, is to not damage the school's reputation. No one is saying that he is criminally responsible for what happened. He is not facing jail time, as far as I know. But, if he allowed a guy who repeatedly abused his wife to stay with his program, and engaged in a cover-up, it hurts the reputation of his employer.
Urban is the face of OSU football. Part of his job, aside from winning football games, is to not damage the school's reputation. No one is saying that he is criminally responsible for what happened. He is not facing jail time, as far as I know. But, if he allowed a guy who repeatedly abused his wife to stay with his program, and engaged in a cover-up, it hurts the reputation of his employer.
Privately talking to Smith and telling him to "knock it off" was excusable in 2009. But by 2015, any football coach should have known better than to try to "keep it in the family."
Man, I get it, I do.
But Meyer is screwed here.
I don't know if you've been in an administrative role before, I have. Three times now. Once in a school system, once in a bar, and now in a landscape company.
Liability is one of the biggest factors an administrator faces. Right or wrong.
I've dealt with students and their parents, drunk and belligerent bar patrons, and legal discourse over tens of thousands of dollars combined with general quality and safety issues.
If Carlos is driving a mowing rig around, and the trailer lights are out because we didn't take care of them, and he gets rear ended, guess who's fault that is? The company's.
In my case, if I design and sell a landscape, and someone under good faith signs into it, and then it turns out I put $10,000 of shade plants in full sun and they all die, guess who that's on? Me, personally.
And those are random example of things that could happen, and there's much, much worse.
At the end of the day, it IS going to fall on the person in charge, ESPECIALLY at the level that college football coach is in.
Meyer employed this guy at two schools, for about a decade. He's the guy in charge. It's on him. Especially because this involves employees at a university that is under all kinds of legal scrutiny and paying millions of and millions of dollars to protect itself. The head coach is the point man on that.
Even if, somehow, EVERYBODY but Urban knew about this, he has to go.
And that's just the way it is, especially now.
You all are right on what you’re saying, you guys are just talking about what is and I’m talking about what should be. I don’t even like Meyer but this is bullshit as far as I’m concerned. People are making moral judgments (fair) and then using it to basically hang one person (unfair). That mob mentality is dangerous. There’s so much fail in that situation before you even get to Urban.
I think Meyer is gone, not because he's legally culpable or because of the exact specifics of what he knew and did or did not do. It's because of the public relations nightmare and embarrassment to the university. The wrestling team sex scandal that blew up last month combined with the Meyer/Zach Smith thing puts Meyer in a no win situation. Is it fair? I don't know, maybe not. But Urban Meyer is the face of the football program and in many ways the face of the university. Ohio State as an institution has been shamed and is getting pounded relentlessly by the media. Even if the supposed internal investigation finds no proof that Meyer knew (other than the texts with pictures that Shelly Meyer got) what had been going on, I don't think it will matter. He gone.
He’s definitely gone because the university is going to try and cover their own ass. Meyer didn’t lie to them or keep anything from them...they knew. The ex said Ohio St.’s counsel contacted her lawyer to ask them about the last incident and how bad it was. That’s what’s being missed. They knew and kept Smith employed, as a university they could have fired them right then. Why didn’t they? They seem to be the ones engaged in a cover up. This is above Urban. He’s the easy target though.
Urban Meyer isn't some regular schmoe. He's a public figure in a leadership position over a large organization getting paid millions of dollars per year. Dealing with constant public scrutiny and increased responsibility beyond what most people can handle is a part of the job.
So what should he have done? Fire him is the easy answer and apparently the preferred outcome. Would firing him have been better for the wife? For the kids? Maybe firing him would have got her out of the relationship faster. Maybe it would have convinced him to get help. Maybe it would have broke the family financially. Maybe he would have gone home, got drunk and beat her into a coma. It’s not an easy solution is all I’m saying. Firing Smith would have been better for Urban Meyer and OSU for sure.
Not to mention, based on what I've read, the guy has never been charged with a crime. So Meyer is supposed to fire the guy based on allegations?
These police reports and DV hearings are all public record. It's not like it was some big secret.
It also looks like this girl went out of her way to build a case against the alleged abuser. Everytime the police go out in these situations, they are supposed to inform the victims of their rights to file protective orders and also make arrests if there are injuries. Why is this stuff just coming out now?
That’s why it’s going to be tough to fire Urb for cause. They’ll probably have to pay him a big chunk of that contract he just signed. I’m sure they’re hoping that they can salvage him, but there’s blood in the water now.
The police knew. The courts knew. The school knew. The family knew. Who else was there to report to?
What is there to report if the school already knew? This isn’t like Baylor where victims went to Briles and he failed to report anything. The victim went to law enforcement first. Law enforcement presumably then went to the university evidenced by the fact that their lawyers contacted hers. So what exactly was Meyer to call and tell them? They knew.
And we know that he didn't?
This is my entire issue at this point in time - we don't know the facts however a majority of people are calling for his job.
Once it's settled that he did something inappropriate then I'm there with everyone - fire the guy. But we're jumping to a lot of unverified facts/conclusions.
Right now the environment is, if he knew - fire him, if he didn't know fire him - damn the facts he must be guilty. This is really dangerous stuff.
Reading the article closely, it's not clear that OSU knew. An OSU-affiliated attorney, their Huntley Johnson, contacted the wife's attorney, but he said he was Zach Smith's lawyer. He said he didn't give OSU any information because it would violate attorney-client privilege. It's hard to believe OSU didn't know, given the numerous 911 calls. But if Urb knew and didn't report it to his superiors, then his firing is absolutely justified. If OSU knew close to as much as Urb., then this is all horseshit.
I wonder who would win, Urban Meyer with Wonder Woman's lasso around him, or Wonder Woman.
Nobody's talking about Zack Smith because nobody's ever heard of him.
Urb should probably go with a defense something like this - "I didn't say anything because I'm terrified of him. That sonuvabitch is flat-out crazy."
Maybe even make up some BS about how Smith had bullied him & threatened to harm Urbie & his family if he said anything. He's a smooth enough liar to easily pull that off & make it sound true.
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