Michigan's fans thoughts on the game...

[Michi_Gator]

What do you mean what does it have to do with the conversation? You said he needed to learn that offense has evolved. Last time the two teams played, his offense gashed your defense like it wasn't even there

Because the idea that spread offenses give Harbaugh fits because, like old Saban, he sees football as line up and run at people for 4 quarters.

It has nothing to do with the effectiveness of his offense but rather his ability to stop the new offenses.

 

[jorg96]

SEc,SEC,SEC.

They seem to be unable to deal with a little pregame smack talk.

 

[jorg96]

Because the idea that spread offenses give Harbaugh fits because, like old Saban, he sees football as line up and run at people for 4 quarters.

It has nothing to do with the effectiveness of his offense but rather his ability to stop the new offenses.

Keep in mind Harbaugh doesn't run the defense. Don Brown does. Check out Don Browns stats vs fsu and Clemson. You are right there are definitely some elements of your offense that gave UM trouble last year while in the first year of the new system. I'm looking forward to seeing if some of that is cleaned up or if we need to keep filling holes. Harbaugh also had a winning record against Oregon

 

[hfhmilkman]

Greetings. I saw this post and as a many decade Michigan fan I figured I would give my insights. Both sides have a lot of new starters on defense. There will be new folks who are under the radar who will surprise. UM has two individuals who are generally more highly regarded than UF's two best defenders who are their DE's. Hurst graded out as the best tackle in all of college football as a starter in everything but name only. I will not comment on if he truly is as coaches know better than pure statistics which are sometimes wrong.

I had originally strongly favored UM, but turned to a tossup when I learned Calloway was being reinstated. Now I think a 4 point spread is more reasonable now that he is gone. My reasoning is that with all of the new faces on both sides Calloway was a given. He alone was worth 6-10 points especially against a very young Michigan secondary. One mistake and 3pts, or one big mistake and 7 points. Now it is even. Both sides have loaded WR talent UF has a little more experience at WR, and UM a little more with the TE's. They are all birds in the bush and Calloway was a bird in the hand.

This thread began with UM fans confident of the Brown verses Nussmeier matchup. It is not because I think Nussmeier stinks though I think he is overrated. It is because of the strengths of Brown verses Nussmeier's weakness's.

Brown thrives at destroying inside zone and spread & shred. He does this by being hyper aggressive and upsetting the schedule of the other team. Brown's scheme's might not work so well verses air raid, power, or NE style spread. Power does not care if you blitz because they expect it and still think they will beat you. Air raid and pass spread just has to succeed once in three times or goes over the top and makes you pay. On schedule just gets a 1st down.

The problem with Nussmeier is he is an inside zone guy who depends heavily on being on schedule. Being on schedule gets disrupted when you get knocked off schedule by a big defensive play. Nussmeier at UF so far and when he was at Michigan did not have an answer to when it was worse then 2nd and 6 or 3rd and 3. If Malik Zaire is the starter things get worse because disrupting running QB's is Brown's specialty. Personally if Zaire starts it means bad things as Zaire as a 5th year senior was unable to beat out a red shirt freshman at ND despite the offense being tailored specifically to him. The pace of Nussmeier teams when he was at UM, and UF were at the bottom. This means the defense has a long time to figure out what the offense is doing and when they show a blitz late, nothing for the QB to do but eat turf.

There is a way for UM to lose and lose badly. Speight is unique in that he is the only QB ever recruited by Al Borges to start a college game. He came to UM not highly regarded and with some problems. If he starts and he reverts to old habits he can be a tire fire. Iowa and Colorado games were great examples where he got rattled and played terrible. What if he takes a big hit in the 1st quarter and forgets all of his mechanics? UM beat Colorado because Peppers beat them with special teams plays. I even saw some bad play against Rutgers. We all see 78-0 but Speight missed several throws early until Harbaugh unleased a bunch of special plays to open the game up. As UF fans know a bad QB can take down the entire offense. Speight still has not won a big game away from home. Is he the next Navarre who can put up big numbers against overmatched opponents or big numbers when the game is out of reach Cutler style? If Speight does not start than any theoretical advantage UM has at QB is gone as both sides have a big question mark.

All in all I think UF's QB situation is shakier and the combination of Hurst/Gary on one side of the line will shut down the inside zone as both command double teams. Without Calloway there is no guarantee that when the youngster in the UM secondary screws up it is for six. Young unproven UF receivers still may do it. But I hear UF may have a frosh corner. So a frosh receiver like Donovan Peoples Jones or Tarik Black have as good a chance at tearing up a UF corner who has four weeks to figure out a defense. Turnovers will be big. If one QB plays awful all bets are off. If both QB's play it close to the vest to prevent mistakes I give UM the edge 17-13 in an ugly game that impresses no one. Both teams will be much better in December than Sept when compared to their peers.

The other coaching edge is Harbaugh really is good at smoke & mirrors. He is usually good for 2-4 rock/paper/scissors calls that work on scheme alone. I think he brought in Pep Hamilton to bring in some spread concepts. In a close game it could be one of these RPS calls that make the difference. Regardless, UM has to show up to play because UF is pretty darn good. Its too bad they do not have a proven QB. Else they could do some BCS damage. If someone surprises my prediction is toast as I can only go on what I think is certain.

 

[instaGATOR]

Yes Michigan is very familiar with the directors cup with 17 top 10 finishes. 12 of those being top 5 finishes.

WoW! Now that's really impressive alright!!!
For 2017, UF only finished at #3....

#1 Stanford can choose their best 20, 10 Men's and 10 Women's.
Stanford has a total of 36 Teams to choose from.

#2 tOSU has a total of 37 teams to choose 20 from.

#3 UF - But that's pretty good, considering having only 21 teams, 9 Men's and 12 Women's, but they can only use a max of 10 each, so UF only has 19 teams that qualify for the Directors Cup points accumulation. So it's obvious that the scoring format for the competition significantly favors schools with more teams in their programs.

The No. 3 finish also extends Florida’s streak of consecutive top-10 finishes in the Directors’ Cup standings to 34 years — the entire span of the competition.

*~* No other school in the entire Nation has finished in the top 10 in every edition of the standings.

 

[Gator Fever]

Greetings. I saw this post and as a many decade Michigan fan I figured I would give my insights. Both sides have a lot of new starters on defense. There will be new folks who are under the radar who will surprise. UM has two individuals who are generally more highly regarded than UF's two best defenders who are their DE's. Hurst graded out as the best tackle in all of college football as a starter in everything but name only. I will not comment on if he truly is as coaches know better than pure statistics which are sometimes wrong.

I had originally strongly favored UM, but turned to a tossup when I learned Calloway was being reinstated. Now I think a 4 point spread is more reasonable now that he is gone. My reasoning is that with all of the new faces on both sides Calloway was a given. He alone was worth 6-10 points especially against a very young Michigan secondary. One mistake and 3pts, or one big mistake and 7 points. Now it is even. Both sides have loaded WR talent UF has a little more experience at WR, and UM a little more with the TE's. They are all birds in the bush and Calloway was a bird in the hand.

This thread began with UM fans confident of the Brown verses Nussmeier matchup. It is not because I think Nussmeier stinks though I think he is overrated. It is because of the strengths of Brown verses Nussmeier's weakness's.

Brown thrives at destroying inside zone and spread & shred. He does this by being hyper aggressive and upsetting the schedule of the other team. Brown's scheme's might not work so well verses air raid, power, or NE style spread. Power does not care if you blitz because they expect it and still think they will beat you. Air raid and pass spread just has to succeed once in three times or goes over the top and makes you pay. On schedule just gets a 1st down.

The problem with Nussmeier is he is an inside zone guy who depends heavily on being on schedule. Being on schedule gets disrupted when you get knocked off schedule by a big defensive play. Nussmeier at UF so far and when he was at Michigan did not have an answer to when it was worse then 2nd and 6 or 3rd and 3. If Malik Zaire is the starter things get worse because disrupting running QB's is Brown's specialty. Personally if Zaire starts it means bad things as Zaire as a 5th year senior was unable to beat out a red shirt freshman at ND despite the offense being tailored specifically to him. The pace of Nussmeier teams when he was at UM, and UF were at the bottom. This means the defense has a long time to figure out what the offense is doing and when they show a blitz late, nothing for the QB to do but eat turf.

There is a way for UM to lose and lose badly. Speight is unique in that he is the only QB ever recruited by Al Borges to start a college game. He came to UM not highly regarded and with some problems. If he starts and he reverts to old habits he can be a tire fire. Iowa and Colorado games were great examples where he got rattled and played terrible. What if he takes a big hit in the 1st quarter and forgets all of his mechanics? UM beat Colorado because Peppers beat them with special teams plays. I even saw some bad play against Rutgers. We all see 78-0 but Speight missed several throws early until Harbaugh unleased a bunch of special plays to open the game up. As UF fans know a bad QB can take down the entire offense. Speight still has not won a big game away from home. Is he the next Navarre who can put up big numbers against overmatched opponents or big numbers when the game is out of reach Cutler style? If Speight does not start than any theoretical advantage UM has at QB is gone as both sides have a big question mark.

All in all I think UF's QB situation is shakier and the combination of Hurst/Gary on one side of the line will shut down the inside zone as both command double teams. Without Calloway there is no guarantee that when the youngster in the UM secondary screws up it is for six. Young unproven UF receivers still may do it. But I hear UF may have a frosh corner. So a frosh receiver like Donovan Peoples Jones or Tarik Black have as good a chance at tearing up a UF corner who has four weeks to figure out a defense. Turnovers will be big. If one QB plays awful all bets are off. If both QB's play it close to the vest to prevent mistakes I give UM the edge 17-13 in an ugly game that impresses no one. Both teams will be much better in December than Sept when compared to their peers.

The other coaching edge is Harbaugh really is good at smoke & mirrors. He is usually good for 2-4 rock/paper/scissors calls that work on scheme alone. I think he brought in Pep Hamilton to bring in some spread concepts. In a close game it could be one of these RPS calls that make the difference. Regardless, UM has to show up to play because UF is pretty darn good. Its too bad they do not have a proven QB. Else they could do some BCS damage. If someone surprises my prediction is toast as I can only go on what I think is certain.

I think that blitzing will give us some trouble but Zaire is probably the QB less likely to fall apart against it. In his limited play he has protected the football. I think our LT will hold up against whatever DE you put out there on his side. Our RT while strong seems to have a time dealing with speed sometimes so Gary may give him some fits. Not sure how our guards will hold up against Hurst. If its Heggie and Jordan their fundamentals in pass defense seem to be alright but Hurst is pretty dominant.

 

[EvilWayz]

How many points did you get worked over for in that matchup with fsu?

If your team was as talented as F$U, that might be germane to the discussion. Y'all ain't.

 

[PacoGator19]

Harbaugh = the best coach that has never won anything

 

[46885]

jam still hasn't had his good teams yet with hoke leftovers or a QB, when he does... I mean do people really think he wouldn't do at least the same as much as meyer if they switched rosters? He's a better football coach, smart wise and x's and o's...


Not to mention the absolute robbery tragedy of their osu game last year straight taken from them by fans officiating the game... Flat out travesty embarrassing bullshit that whole thing was...

 

[PacoGator19]

jam still hasn't had his good teams yet with hoke leftovers or a QB, when he does... I mean do people really think he wouldn't do at least the same as much as meyer if they switched rosters? He's a better football coach, smart wise and x's and o's...


Not to mention the absolute robbery tragedy of their osu game last year straight taken from them by fans officiating the game... Flat out travesty embarrassing bullshit that whole thing was...

He's not a better college football coach than Urban Meyer. Not when Urban Meyer is "all in" like we have seen. Meyer is one of the GOAT. Harbaugh needs to win something first.

Meyer won a national championship with someone else's players (2006) and then won a national championship with his own players (2008). That is about as impressive as it gets for a coach.

 

[hfhmilkman]

I agree that Harbaugh has to win a big game first. It will take some time until his QB is ready. I'm still impressed by what he did with Kapernick. He introduced zone read concepts and really took the NFL off guard. Kap was ultimately done in with what thwarted Cam Newton. In the NFL it all comes down to accuracy and he just does not have it. Anyone can bomb away when the other team is panicking. What do you do in an evenly matched game? It becomes a lot tougher. This game really comes down to which QB gets the opportunity to make a play and is given a chance. I'm hoping that Harbaugh being as good a QB coach as there is gives UM an edge. He seems to get the most out of QB's even when they are rejects.

 

[46885]

He's not a better college football coach than Urban Meyer. Not when Urban Meyer is "all in" like we have seen. Meyer is one of the GOAT. Harbaugh needs to win something first.

Meyer won a national championship with someone else's players (2006) and then won a national championship with his own players (2008). That is about as impressive as it gets for a coach.

Harbaugh is just as good of a football coach and a smarter "Football" coach with the in depth understanding of the game, what he's done at michigan so far is over achieved... Could meyer coach a squad in the NFL to a Super Bowl, much less the two he damn near got two? No way

Harbaugh is a better football coach than Meyer, he hasn't had near the players at michigan yet, yet still beat their ass in their stadium last year before the fans in stripes stepped in and cheated and assured they didn't...

 

[PacoGator19]

Harbaugh is just as good of a football coach and a smarter "Football" coach with the in depth understanding of the game, what he's done at michigan so far is over achieved... Could meyer coach a squad in the NFL to a Super Bowl, much less the two he damn near got two? No way

Harbaugh is a better football coach than Meyer, he hasn't had near the players at michigan yet, yet still beat their ass in their stadium last year before the fans in stripes stepped in and cheated and assured they didn't...

Disagree. Overachieving is winning a National Championship in just your 2nd year with a team that is made of up mostly somebody else's players.

I say it to this day one of the best coaching jobs I have ever seen in college football was what Urban Meyer did with that 2006 UF team. Take a look at the players that started in that game. Not many players did much of anything in the NFL.

This was the starting oline from left to right Trautwein, Tartt, Rissler, Miller, Medder. You kidding me? How do you when a National Title with an oline like that? Look at the rest of the starting lineup from that team. Talk about overachieving. The CBs were made up of a transfer from Utah and a converted WR (Reggie Lewis)

 

[Gator Fever]

He's not a better college football coach than Urban Meyer. Not when Urban Meyer is "all in" like we have seen. Meyer is one of the GOAT. Harbaugh needs to win something first.

Meyer won a national championship with someone else's players (2006) and then won a national championship with his own players (2008). That is about as impressive as it gets for a coach.

Not saying he is better than Meyer but he has had two very quick turnarounds in college and despite not winning his conference Stanford was 12-1 in 2010 with the only loss to Oregon who barely lost the BCSCG that year to Auburn.

 

[bradleygator]

Disagree. Overachieving is winning a National Championship in just your 2nd year with a team that is made of up mostly somebody else's players.

I say it to this day one of the best coaching jobs I have ever seen in college football was what Urban Meyer did with that 2006 UF team. Take a look at the players that started in that game. Not many players did much of anything in the NFL.

This was the starting oline from left to right Trautwein, Tartt, Rissler, Miller, Medder. You kidding me? How do you when a National Title with an oline like that? Look at the rest of the starting lineup from that team. Talk about overachieving. The CBs were made up of a transfer from Utah and a converted WR (Reggie Lewis)

I agree with your overall point that Meyer did one of the all time coaching jobs with that team. Splitting the quarterback job to get Tebow's running into an offense designed for it was genius. But they had a lot of talent on that team, particularly on defense and at the skill positions. Tebow was one of the great goal line and short yardage runners of all time. Ingram, Caldwell, Harvin, Baker, Murphy and Nelson all played in the NFL at receiver. Dallas Baker was great his senior year. On Defense: Reggie Nelson, Early Everett, Harvey, Cohen, Moss, Ray McDonald, etc... Ryan Smith was the the man!

 

[jimjim47]

Greetings. I saw this post and as a many decade Michigan fan I figured I would give my insights. Both sides have a lot of new starters on defense. There will be new folks who are under the radar who will surprise. UM has two individuals who are generally more highly regarded than UF's two best defenders who are their DE's. Hurst graded out as the best tackle in all of college football as a starter in everything but name only. I will not comment on if he truly is as coaches know better than pure statistics which are sometimes wrong.

I had originally strongly favored UM, but turned to a tossup when I learned Calloway was being reinstated. Now I think a 4 point spread is more reasonable now that he is gone. My reasoning is that with all of the new faces on both sides Calloway was a given. He alone was worth 6-10 points especially against a very young Michigan secondary. One mistake and 3pts, or one big mistake and 7 points. Now it is even. Both sides have loaded WR talent UF has a little more experience at WR, and UM a little more with the TE's. They are all birds in the bush and Calloway was a bird in the hand.

This thread began with UM fans confident of the Brown verses Nussmeier matchup. It is not because I think Nussmeier stinks though I think he is overrated. It is because of the strengths of Brown verses Nussmeier's weakness's.

Brown thrives at destroying inside zone and spread & shred. He does this by being hyper aggressive and upsetting the schedule of the other team. Brown's scheme's might not work so well verses air raid, power, or NE style spread. Power does not care if you blitz because they expect it and still think they will beat you. Air raid and pass spread just has to succeed once in three times or goes over the top and makes you pay. On schedule just gets a 1st down.

The problem with Nussmeier is he is an inside zone guy who depends heavily on being on schedule. Being on schedule gets disrupted when you get knocked off schedule by a big defensive play. Nussmeier at UF so far and when he was at Michigan did not have an answer to when it was worse then 2nd and 6 or 3rd and 3. If Malik Zaire is the starter things get worse because disrupting running QB's is Brown's specialty. Personally if Zaire starts it means bad things as Zaire as a 5th year senior was unable to beat out a red shirt freshman at ND despite the offense being tailored specifically to him. The pace of Nussmeier teams when he was at UM, and UF were at the bottom. This means the defense has a long time to figure out what the offense is doing and when they show a blitz late, nothing for the QB to do but eat turf.

There is a way for UM to lose and lose badly. Speight is unique in that he is the only QB ever recruited by Al Borges to start a college game. He came to UM not highly regarded and with some problems. If he starts and he reverts to old habits he can be a tire fire. Iowa and Colorado games were great examples where he got rattled and played terrible. What if he takes a big hit in the 1st quarter and forgets all of his mechanics? UM beat Colorado because Peppers beat them with special teams plays. I even saw some bad play against Rutgers. We all see 78-0 but Speight missed several throws early until Harbaugh unleased a bunch of special plays to open the game up. As UF fans know a bad QB can take down the entire offense. Speight still has not won a big game away from home. Is he the next Navarre who can put up big numbers against overmatched opponents or big numbers when the game is out of reach Cutler style? If Speight does not start than any theoretical advantage UM has at QB is gone as both sides have a big question mark.

All in all I think UF's QB situation is shakier and the combination of Hurst/Gary on one side of the line will shut down the inside zone as both command double teams. Without Calloway there is no guarantee that when the youngster in the UM secondary screws up it is for six. Young unproven UF receivers still may do it. But I hear UF may have a frosh corner. So a frosh receiver like Donovan Peoples Jones or Tarik Black have as good a chance at tearing up a UF corner who has four weeks to figure out a defense. Turnovers will be big. If one QB plays awful all bets are off. If both QB's play it close to the vest to prevent mistakes I give UM the edge 17-13 in an ugly game that impresses no one. Both teams will be much better in December than Sept when compared to their peers.

The other coaching edge is Harbaugh really is good at smoke & mirrors. He is usually good for 2-4 rock/paper/scissors calls that work on scheme alone. I think he brought in Pep Hamilton to bring in some spread concepts. In a close game it could be one of these RPS calls that make the difference. Regardless, UM has to show up to play because UF is pretty darn good. Its too bad they do not have a proven QB. Else they could do some BCS damage. If someone surprises my prediction is toast as I can only go on what I think is certain.

Excellent analysis.

The major advantage Florida had was Callaway against Michigan's young secondary. While the Michigan secondary is young the rest of Florida's receivers can not match Callaway's experience and production. Florida has recruited some excellent receivers but so has Michigan (Donavan Peoples Jones number 1 HS receiver last year, highly recruited by both Florida and Ohio State), Tariq Black (Alabama offered).

Wilton Speight's experience is an advantage. He did not play well against Iowa or FSU but in terms of big away games he was very good against Michigan State last year. Remains to be seen which Speight shows up against Florida.

It will be a close game.

If Michigan's young (3 new starters) offensive line is << than last year it will be a long day for Michigan.

Florida will be highly motivated as will Michigan.

Florida has not played an OCC game out of the state of Florida since 1991 and has not had a opener against a highly rated team since? Does this mean anything (Rick Neuheisal on Sirius radio thinks so)?

I like Harbaugh over McElwain as a game day coach and I believe so do Pro Football GM's if they were going to hire a new coach as well as most college AD's.

 

[oozie7]

Harbaugh has most definitely overachieved so far at UM. Are people forgetting he took over a 5-7 team? In year one with a QB who lost his job at Iowa he won 10 games. Last year he won 10 again. He's also won at the highest levels...THREE straight conference title appearances which has never been done in the history of the NFL and a Super Bowl appearance in 4 years.

I don't get the 'he hasn't won anything' critique. Winning is as much about circumstance as it is raw talent. Was he supposed to win a title at San Diego? He immediately turned them around. Stanford won ONE game the year before he took over there, in 3 years he goes 12-1 and beat stacked USC teams even before then with a trash roster. Michigan is the first school he's been at that's capable of winning a title. If he doesn't win a title there then by all means feel free to critique him. But Meyer nor Saban are winning titles at San Diego or Stanford. The critique about him not winning a title would be more valid if he was, ya know, at a place capable of winning one before now.

 

[jimjim47]

Harbaugh has most definitely overachieved so far at UM. Are people forgetting he took over a 5-7 team? In year one with a QB who lost his job at Iowa he won 10 games. Last year he won 10 again. He's also won at the highest levels...THREE straight conference title appearances which has never been done in the history of the NFL and a Super Bowl appearance in 4 years.

I don't get the 'he hasn't won anything' critique. Winning is as much about circumstance as it is raw talent. Was he supposed to win a title at San Diego? He immediately turned them around. Stanford won ONE game the year before he took over there, in 3 years he goes 12-1 and beat stacked USC teams even before then with a trash roster. Michigan is the first school he's been at that's capable of winning a title. If he doesn't win a title there then by all means feel free to critique him. But Meyer nor Saban are winning titles at San Diego or Stanford. The critique about him not winning a title would be more valid if he was, ya know, at a place capable of winning one before now.

Harbaugh took that Iowa "reject" QB, Rudock, and coached him into a pro drafted quarterback (2nd string for the Lions), teaching him how to read defenses, go thru progressions, improved footwork, etc.

Saban and Meyer are great college coaches but you can not "recruit" your way to get your team into the Super Bowl. Ask the Miami Dolphins and Nick Saban when he coached them.

 

[Gator Fever]

Harbaugh took that Iowa "reject" QB, Rudock, and coached him into a pro drafted quarterback (2nd string for the Lions), teaching him how to read defenses, go thru progressions, improved footwork, etc.

Saban and Meyer are great college coaches but you can not "recruit" your way to get your team into the Super Bowl. Ask the Miami Dolphins and Nick Saban when he coached them.

Not saying he is clearly better in reality as a college coach but Meyer doing what he did at Utah takes the recruiting argument away some.

 

[Michi_Gator]

Harbaugh took that Iowa "reject" QB, Rudock, and coached him into a pro drafted quarterback (2nd string for the Lions), teaching him how to read defenses, go thru progressions, improved footwork, etc.

Saban and Meyer are great college coaches but you can not "recruit" your way to get your team into the Super Bowl. Ask the Miami Dolphins and Nick Saban when he coached them.

Meyer just recruits? Bowling Green? Utah? Two NCs at UF, the first of which was with a QB that wasn't his? (And yes, thats a thing, just read the UM or UF board and count the posts saying, "when Harbaugh gets his players" or "when Mac gets his players". Or his playoff NC at tOSU where he spread it out to beat Saban then went to a pound it out offense to beat Oregon 9 days later. Those accomplsihments don't scream "recruiting his way to a title". And lol at Saban winning on recruiting alone.

Harbaugh is a great coach, no doubt. Probably better suited for the NFL where the game is more in-line with his philosophy and there are not time restrictions. Harbaugh, much like Mac, is still looking to put a major signature win on the board.

 

[PacoGator19]

Meyer is one of the GOAT college football coaches. Harbaugh wouldn't even be in the discussion.

 

[bradleygator]

Meyer is one of the GOAT college football coaches. Harbaugh wouldn't even be in the discussion.

This is true. In 5-10 years who knows? Harbaugh will probably go back to the NFL at some point.

 

[46885]

Disagree. Overachieving is winning a National Championship in just your 2nd year with a team that is made of up mostly somebody else's players.

I say it to this day one of the best coaching jobs I have ever seen in college football was what Urban Meyer did with that 2006 UF team. Take a look at the players that started in that game. Not many players did much of anything in the NFL.

This was the starting oline from left to right Trautwein, Tartt, Rissler, Miller, Medder. You kidding me? How do you when a National Title with an oline like that? Look at the rest of the starting lineup from that team. Talk about overachieving. The CBs were made up of a transfer from Utah and a converted WR (Reggie Lewis)

again, how many other coaches could do what harbaugh has done with the michigan roster the last two years, you think Meyer and Saban would have done more or even at least win ten games both seasons? how much worse off do you think Saban was his first year at Bama than Harbaugh two years ago?

Harbaugh has most definitely overachieved so far at UM. Are people forgetting he took over a 5-7 team? In year one with a QB who lost his job at Iowa he won 10 games. Last year he won 10 again. He's also won at the highest levels...THREE straight conference title appearances which has never been done in the history of the NFL and a Super Bowl appearance in 4 years.

I don't get the 'he hasn't won anything' critique. Winning is as much about circumstance as it is raw talent. Was he supposed to win a title at San Diego? He immediately turned them around. Stanford won ONE game the year before he took over there, in 3 years he goes 12-1 and beat stacked USC teams even before then with a trash roster. Michigan is the first school he's been at that's capable of winning a title. If he doesn't win a title there then by all means feel free to critique him. But Meyer nor Saban are winning titles at San Diego or Stanford. The critique about him not winning a title would be more valid if he was, ya know, at a place capable of winning one before now.

exactly, if you don't think Harbaugh is even close to these coaches ability because he hasn't had their level of talent yet to win hardware, then you either just don't like the guy or are being obtuse about it, and don't really understand football and circumstances of talent very well from program to program.. Harbaugh could have done just fine with our roster in 06 himself, im sure of it...

 

[jimjim47]

Harbaugh took that Iowa "reject" QB, Rudock, and coached him into a pro drafted quarterback (2nd string for the Lions), teaching him how to read defenses, go thru progressions, improved footwork, etc.

Meyer just recruits? Bowling Green? Utah? Two NCs at UF, the first of which was with a QB that wasn't his? (And yes, thats a thing, just read the UM or UF board and count the posts saying, "when Harbaugh gets his players" or "when Mac gets his players". Or his playoff NC at tOSU where he spread it out to beat Saban then went to a pound it out offense to beat Oregon 9 days later. Those accomplsihments don't scream "recruiting his way to a title". And lol at Saban winning on recruiting alone.

Harbaugh is a great coach, no doubt. Probably better suited for the NFL where the game is more in-line with his philosophy and there are not time restrictions. Harbaugh, much like Mac, is still looking to put a major signature win on the board.

Never said Saban won on recruiting alone (obviously he is a excellent college coach) but in the pros Saban could not win big due to not gaining an advantage by recruiting. It is all based on coaching in the pros. For this reason I don't think Saban would ever return to the pros and Meyer would never go to the pros.

 

[46885]

and when he was at MSU with mediocre talent, he did much less than the current coach has done for a decade that no one can still even pronounce his name... and ironically enough he looks like Sabans dad

 

[46885]

Saban, like many other coaches, with lesser or equal talent is not quite as great as they are made up to be...


Spurrier has given Saban the biggest spankings of his life, even at god damn South CAROLINA with Bama at their highest in talent on the roster... But GOD FORBID someone mention Spurrier in the same stature or league, sentence with Saban. Ive still to this day never seen Saban teams and defenses take lashings bent over like Spurrier coached teams and offenses gave his defenses... LSU in 00, 01 LOL 44-15 in BR, even Zook beat his NC team with Spurriers players the 03 year... then the blasting in 2010 in columbia with a drunk fat gut QB and one NFL WR and RB... compared to everything NFL on the other roster, Spurrier is an SEC legend and because he left UF in his prime of the program working into dynasty level talent and seasons... he's not mentioned as even a GOAT because of Saban? It's pure nonsense, ignorance and shows you just how long fans really haven't been watching football, especially all these new bama "fans" of the earth... They sure as hell weren't around when I was there with Shula...

 

[blockm2]

Harbaugh, like Saban did a few years back, needs to understand offense has evolved since 1850.

So your advice to Harbaugh is that the coach that had Colin Kaepernick running roughshod over the NFL with the read option should understand that offense has evolved? You don't say.

Harbaugh is actually one of the most flexible offensive coaches in the country. He'll run formations with anything from 5 WRs to 5 TEs to 3 FBs on the field at a time. He's open to read option, pro style, and air raid concepts. He tries to design his offense around the strengths of his players. His best QB is a pro style QB so that's what he runs. When Speight is gone they will run more read option since the younger QBs are more dual threat types.

 

[blockm2]

This thread isn't worth an ish anymore.

It basically goes like this.... Michigan and Florida had similar seasons last year. Florida returns a lot and Michigan is starting a ton of new players....all of the returnees for Florida suck...all of these new guys for Michigan are future first round draft picks.

If I had to make simple...

Michigan fans feel Harbaugh and his assistants are much better than McElwain and his assistants. And while Michigan loses a lot from an elite defense last year, at least they have an elite coach and elite talent to replace it with. Florida was god awful on offense last season and brings many of those players back along with their poor coaches.

Michigan defense >>>>> Florida offense
Florida defense >>> Michigan offense
Florida ST > Michigan ST
Michigan coaches >>> Florida coaches


But unlike many on both sides, I actually predict a fairly close game. I'd be surprised if the margin was > 7 points.

 

[Gator Fever]

So your advice to Harbaugh is that the coach that had Colin Kaepernick running roughshod over the NFL with the read option should understand that offense has evolved? You don't say.

Harbaugh is actually one of the most flexible offensive coaches in the country. He'll run formations with anything from 5 WRs to 5 TEs to 3 FBs on the field at a time. He's open to read option, pro style, and air raid concepts. He tries to design his offense around the strengths of his players. His best QB is a pro style QB so that's what he runs. When Speight is gone they will run more read option since the younger QBs are more dual threat types.

lol Harbaugh runs mostly gap based power stuff with a FB and that gets shut down usually against a team with a real good D line.

What did you guys average rushing the ball against FSU and OSU the past 2 years? Not saying its not effective when facing sub elite teams if you have some talent but its more of a throwback than modern spread stuff.

 

[Michi_Gator]

If I had to make simple...

Michigan fans feel Harbaugh and his assistants are much better than McElwain and his assistants. And while Michigan loses a lot from an elite defense last year, at least they have an elite coach and elite talent to replace it with. Florida was god awful on offense last season and brings many of those players back along with their poor coaches.

Michigan defense >>>>> Florida offense
Florida defense >>> Michigan offense
Florida ST > Michigan ST
Michigan coaches >>> Florida coaches


But unlike many on both sides, I actually predict a fairly close game. I'd be surprised if the margin was > 7 points.

Michigan fans feel Harbaugh is better than every coach. Thinking he is better than Mac is not really saying a lot. As far as his assistants, meh. Brown is good, but other than Nord and Nuss I think UF has a pretty solid staff. I would say other than HBC, your coaching edge is minimal.

 

[Michi_Gator]

lol Harbaugh runs mostly gap based power stuff with a FB and that gets shut down usually against a team with a real good D line.

What did you guys average rushing the ball against FSU and OSU the past 2 years? Not saying its not effective when facing sub elite teams if you have some talent but its more of a throwback than modern spread stuff.

The fact he uses a FB completely discredits anything modern. And when he tried to get creative with Peppers the good teams like tOSU shut it down. Why? Because again, its out of his realm of lets line up and run between the tackles

 

[Michi_Gator]

Harbaugh has most definitely overachieved so far at UM. Are people forgetting he took over a 5-7 team? In year one with a QB who lost his job at Iowa he won 10 games. Last year he won 10 again. He's also won at the highest levels...THREE straight conference title appearances which has never been done in the history of the NFL and a Super Bowl appearance in 4 years.

I don't get the 'he hasn't won anything' critique. Winning is as much about circumstance as it is raw talent. Was he supposed to win a title at San Diego? He immediately turned them around. Stanford won ONE game the year before he took over there, in 3 years he goes 12-1 and beat stacked USC teams even before then with a trash roster. Michigan is the first school he's been at that's capable of winning a title. If he doesn't win a title there then by all means feel free to critique him. But Meyer nor Saban are winning titles at San Diego or Stanford. The critique about him not winning a title would be more valid if he was, ya know, at a place capable of winning one before now.

Harbaugh took over a 5-7 team is a bit misleading. Hoke recruited very well. Go look at the first two rounds of last years NFL draft and throw in later round guys like Butt, who was one of the best TE in the country. ALL of those guys were on the roater when he arrived and recruited by Hoke. So yeah, they were 5-7, but there was a shitload of talent there.

Now, I have always talked up Harbaugh as a coach, but we are sterching it a littw

 

[46885]

no, he gets way too disrespected by casuals all over the football world like he's some underachiever.. when he's literally the exact opposite

 

[oozie7]

Harbaugh took over a 5-7 team is a bit misleading. Hoke recruited very well. Go look at the first two rounds of last years NFL draft and throw in later round guys like Butt, who was one of the best TE in the country. ALL of those guys were on the roater when he arrived and recruited by Hoke. So yeah, they were 5-7, but there was a shitload of talent there.

Now, I have always talked up Harbaugh as a coach, but we are sterching it a littw

But none of those guys had done anything when he got there. So it's safe to say he developed them. Like the Rudock example...that kid went from losing his job at Iowa on one of the worst offenses in the country to being a legitimate backup in the NFL in one year. What had guys like Butt done up to that point?

If anything, Harbaugh is underrated. Like y'all talk about his offense being rigid and it's anything but. He ran two completely different offenses with Alex Smith and Kaepernick. His offense with Kaepernick was a hybrid power-spread scheme from the pistol which was completely different from what he ran with Smith. And all of that was completely different from what he ran with Andrew Luck. He's one of the few coaches in football who can say they change their offense depending on the player and have it not just be a cliche, there's actual proof of him doing just that.

 

[Michi_Gator]

But none of those guys had done anything when he got there. So it's safe to say he developed them. Like the Rudock example...that kid went from losing his job at Iowa on one of the worst offenses in the country to being a legitimate backup in the NFL in one year. What had guys like Butt done up to that point?

If anything, Harbaugh is underrated. Like y'all talk about his offense being rigid and it's anything but. He ran two completely different offenses with Alex Smith and Kaepernick. His offense with Kaepernick was a hybrid power-spread scheme from the pistol which was completely different from what he ran with Smith. And all of that was completely different from what he ran with Andrew Luck. He's one of the few coaches in football who can say they change their offense depending on the player and have it not just be a cliche, there's actual proof of him doing just that.

No one has called him overrated. People have pointed out he has really done nothing significant at Michigan. And he really doesn't have a win to prove otherwise at Michigan. I mean his biggest accomplishment is either making Mac look like a middle school coach in the bowl game or his domination of what ended up being a very good PSU team last year.

And I get his NFL accomplishments, adjustments, etc. i am a lifelong Niners fan, fully aware. I think he is actually much better suited for the NFL, largely due to the lack of time limitations.

And adjusting to players is good. Better than hearing our last two staffs say that they weren't changing their systems to fit players and watching Weiss run 160 lb, 4.3 kids between the tackles.

But at the end of the day, if he wants in the Meyer/Saban convo he will have to at least make it to the Little 10 Title game at some point.

But all this and everybody expects us to win??? I have said for a year, with an entire offseason to prep I don't see how we win this game v Harbaugh.

 

[hfhmilkman]

lol Harbaugh runs mostly gap based power stuff with a FB and that gets shut down usually against a team with a real good D line.

What did you guys average rushing the ball against FSU and OSU the past 2 years? Not saying its not effective when facing sub elite teams if you have some talent but its more of a throwback than modern spread stuff.

Harbaugh will roll with what he has. At SF he had a QB who broke a NFL record for most rushing yards. Luck ran for over 800 yards in one season at Stanford. The problem UM has had the last couple years is the talent at Oline just was not there. UM graduated three seniors and not one was drafted. If you do not have a good line does not matter what your rushing concept is if up against an elite team.

 

[LizardGrad89]

If I had to make simple...

Michigan fans feel Harbaugh and his assistants are much better than McElwain and his assistants. And while Michigan loses a lot from an elite defense last year, at least they have an elite coach and elite talent to replace it with. Florida was god awful on offense last season and brings many of those players back along with their poor coaches.

Michigan defense >>>>> Florida offense
Florida defense >>> Michigan offense
Florida ST > Michigan ST
Michigan coaches >>> Florida coaches


But unlike many on both sides, I actually predict a fairly close game. I'd be surprised if the margin was > 7 points.

This is ridiculous from beginning to end,

Here is the most ridiculous point: According to the poster, Florida's special teams are SLIGHTLY better than Michigan's. Florida has a national top 3 kicker and punter, and senior Brandon Powell returning kicks. Michigan has a new kicker, punter, kick returner and punt returner. Evidently all these kids with zero experience are every bit as good as the best special teams unit in the country. Must be because of the color of the uniform. ROFL.

Here's reality:

Florida offense>>Michigan Defense. I don't care who you have, if you have 10 new starters they have no experience playing as a unit. This equals a weak defense. Deal with the reality.

Florida Defense >>>Michigan Offense. Michigan offense replaces 3 starters from an Oline that struggled last year. Florida pass rush will abuse that Oline, making Michigan one-dimensional. One dimensional offenses are no-dimensional offenses.

Florida Special Teams>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Michigan Special Teams. ROFL. See above.

Michigan Coaches>Florida Coaches. I know this will upset the Michigan fans who still haven't wiped Harbaugh's spunk off their collective chins, but McElwain has pulled out some wins we haven't expected, while Harbaugh seems to manage to lose a game or two every year to a team that shouldn't even be on the field with them. I gave the edge to Harbaugh and Co because of the pro experience. Not really a reason, but got to throw them a bone.

I do not see a close game. I think the score will be manageable at the end if Michigan plays to keep the score low, using the entire play clock, running the ball and playing field position. But if they come out high octane, it will get ugly fast.

 

[Michi_Gator]

This is ridiculous from beginning to end,

Here is the most ridiculous point: According to the poster, Florida's special teams are SLIGHTLY better than Michigan's. Florida has a national top 3 kicker and punter, and senior Brandon Powell returning kicks. Michigan has a new kicker, punter, kick returner and punt returner. Evidently all these kids with zero experience are every bit as good as the best special teams unit in the country. Must be because of the color of the uniform. ROFL.

Here's reality:

Florida offense>>Michigan Defense. I don't care who you have, if you have 10 new starters they have no experience playing as a unit. This equals a weak defense. Deal with the reality.

Florida Defense >>>Michigan Offense. Michigan offense replaces 3 starters from an Oline that struggled last year. Florida pass rush will abuse that Oline, making Michigan one-dimensional. One dimensional offenses are no-dimensional offenses.

Florida Special Teams>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Michigan Special Teams. ROFL. See above.

Michigan Coaches>Florida Coaches. I know this will upset the Michigan fans who still haven't wiped Harbaugh's spunk off their collective chins, but McElwain has pulled out some wins we haven't expected, while Harbaugh seems to manage to lose a game or two every year to a team that shouldn't even be on the field with them. I gave the edge to Harbaugh and Co because of the pro experience. Not really a reason, but got to throw them a bone.

I do not see a close game. I think the score will be manageable at the end if Michigan plays to keep the score low, using the entire play clock, running the ball and playing field position. But if they come out high octane, it will get ugly fast.

Some good points BUT no way after the bowl game two years ago can you pretend these head coaches are in the same league. And their DC v our OC is as much of a mismatch as the special teams

 

[oozie7]

No one has called him overrated. People have pointed out he has really done nothing significant at Michigan. And he really doesn't have a win to prove otherwise at Michigan. I mean his biggest accomplishment is either making Mac look like a middle school coach in the bowl game or his domination of what ended up being a very good PSU team last year.

And I get his NFL accomplishments, adjustments, etc. i am a lifelong Niners fan, fully aware. I think he is actually much better suited for the NFL, largely due to the lack of time limitations.

And adjusting to players is good. Better than hearing our last two staffs say that they weren't changing their systems to fit players and watching Weiss run 160 lb, 4.3 kids between the tackles.

But at the end of the day, if he wants in the Meyer/Saban convo he will have to at least make it to the Little 10 Title game at some point.

But all this and everybody expects us to win??? I have said for a year, with an entire offseason to prep I don't see how we win this game v Harbaugh.

I know you don't think he's overrated just more speaking of other people. I agree he needs to win something big but considering where Michigan was I can't see how anybody could not think he hasn't done a great job. For example look at how much he closed the gap between them and Ohio St. in one year. Ohio St. is still significantly more talented than them and had to hold on to dear life on their homefield with Speight at QB for Michigan. Lot of people are gonna eat crow in another year or two is my guess.

 

[instaGATOR]

If I had to make simple...

Michigan fans feel Harbaugh and his assistants are much better than McElwain and his assistants. And while Michigan loses a lot from an elite defense last year, at least they have an elite coach and elite talent to replace it with. Florida was god awful on offense last season and brings many of those players back along with their poor coaches.

Michigan defense >>>>> Florida offense
Florida defense >>> Michigan offense
Florida ST > Michigan ST
Michigan coaches >>> Florida coaches

But unlike many on both sides, I actually predict a fairly close game. I'd be surprised if the margin was > 7 points.

I think that you meant to say 'Simple Minded' in your opening statement.

Coach Jim McElwain - NC OC at Bama in 2009 & 2011.
He was the 2014 MWC CoY & The AFCA Region 5 CoY
Then the 2015 SEC CoY.
>>> And he was just named to the 2017 Bobby Dodd Watch List.
Since 2015 in the SEC, only Bama has more overall wins, and in SEC games, it's UA 15 wins to UF's 13. (He's 11-1 in the SWAMP)
Overall, the Gators are 19-8 under McElwain, which ties Spurrier for the second-most by a UF head coach through his first two seasons.

OC Nussmeier won a NC in 2012, replacing the departing NC OC McElwain.

The DC Randy Shannon won NC's both as a player and as a coach.
UF's 2018 #7 Ranked recruiting class, and their #1 2019 recruiting class speaks very well to the rest of the current assistant coaches quality.
=========

Without WR Callaway the Gators are doomed, as he was the only player on the team with any talent....

WR/RB Brandon Powell 5-8 189 **** 5.8 (4.38/40)
WR Tyrie Cleveland 6-2 205 **** 5.9
WR Josh Hammond 6-1 187 **** 5.9
WR Freddie Swain 6-0 194 **** 5.9
WR Rick Wells 6-0 202 **** 5.8
WR Dre Massey 5-9 186 **** 5.8 (4.35/40)
WR James Robinson 6-4 205 **** 5.9
WR Daquon Green 6-1 195 **** 5.8
WR/QB/RB Kadarius Toney 5-11 194 *** (way underrated)

TE/WR Moral Stephens 6-4 251 **** 5.8
TE Kemore Gamble 6-3 255 **** 5.8
TE DeAndre Goolsby 6-4 239 ***
TE C'yontai Lewis 6-4 235 ***

RB Mark Thompson 6-2 239 ***** (#1RB Juco)
RB Jordan Scarlett 5-11 206 **** 5.8 (2016 5.0 YPC)
RB Lamical Perine 5-11 218 **** 5.8 (Saban tried to flip)
RB Adarius Lemons 6-0 201 **** 5.8
RB Malik Davis 5-11 194 **** 5.8 (Dabo tried to flip)
============

And all of that means NADA when it comes to who will win the game.
Is your check in to the game officials yet, or does UF still have a chance to win it???