Batteries cost more than the car

[jb1215]

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Gary is right, i originally thought it was a waste of time, who couldnt grasp such easy concepts. then i ran into the sheeple on this board. Its amazing to me how stupid and scared people are. it boggles my mind....

Go buy one if you want to. I don't want one. You mind is easily boggled. And Gary sounds pretty uninformed to be polite. Let's try to unboggle your feeble mind for just a brief moment.

1. Battery minerals travel an average of 50,000 miles from extraction to battery cell production. How do you think they are transported?
2. Mining for battery minerals cause surface and groundwater depletion, soil contamination, and biodiversity loss that is unrecoverable.
3. There are currently over 1 million children that are forced labor around the world specifically used to mine essential battery minerals.
4. The tailings from mining operations lays bare on the surface of the Earth, further polluting water sources and vegetation.
5. So, they are not "good for the environment".

 

[fatman76]

Did I post about the stainless steel planar construction yet?

What about it?

 

[fatman76]

Go buy one if you want to. I don't want one. You mind is easily boggled. And Gary sounds pretty uninformed to be polite. Let's try to unboggle your feeble mind for just a brief moment.

1. Battery minerals travel an average of 50,000 miles from extraction to battery cell production. How do you think they are transported?
2. Mining for battery minerals cause surface and groundwater depletion, soil contamination, and biodiversity loss that is unrecoverable.
3. There are currently over 1 million children that are forced labor around the world specifically used to mine essential battery minerals.
4. The tailings from mining operations lays bare on the surface of the Earth, further polluting water sources and vegetation.
5. So, they are not "good for the environment".

"SNOWFLAKE SHEEPY SHEEP!"

- mdf, in about 26 minutes

 

[LordofallSocks]

What about it?

well stainless is a misnomer, it can rust and unlike high carbon steel you can't just buff it off with steel wool. and it can't be molded or repaired unless you like the look of tig welds. also high martensenite steel weakens unless you bend it at right angles.

 

[fatman76]

well stainless is a misnomer, it can rust and unlike high carbon steel you can't just buff it off with steel wool. and it can't be molded or repaired unless you like the look of tig welds. also high martensenite steel weakens unless you bend it at right angles.

I’ve seen the demo where they hit the CT with a sledgehammer and it doesn’t dent. So I doubt door dings are gonna be an issue.

That said you’re right, I hope they apply some sort of clear or it’s gonna be interesting to see how these age.

The right angles thing does sort of explain why it looks so ridiculous.

 

[LordofallSocks]

I’ve seen the demo where they hit the CT with a sledgehammer and it doesn’t dent. So I doubt door dings are gonna be an issue.

Oh that's actually one of the good things, shopping carts are no longer going to be your problem.

And the safety of having a body that does something besides crumple. But what could be fixed with a dent puller will require the replacement of the entire panel in a crash and 3mm ss is not cheap.

That said you’re right, I hope they apply some sort of clear or it’s gonna be interesting to see how these age.

The right angles thing does sort of explain why it looks so ridiculous.

There's some advantages, tooling costs are lower because you aren't pressing anything into shape you're cutting flat panels and welding them.

That's why John DeLorean chose the material in the first place.

Unfortunately, cocaine is a hell of a drug and financial mismanagement kills good idea.

Edit: I misspoke, you have to bend it at angles. Not necessarily right angles.

 

[jb1215]

"SNOWFLAKE SHEEPY SHEEP!"

- mdf, in about 26 minutes

I'm expecting it. He hates facts, just like all libs do.

 

[fatman76]

I'm expecting it. He hates facts, just like all libs do.

Yep.

100% of the time when you post dissenting facts he name calls and deflects. Then he'll tell you to go on a test drive to "educate yourself" because you're clearly an idiot that thinks past 'fun to drive' when you buy a car.

 

[fatman76]

Oh that's actually one of the good things, shopping carts are no longer going to be your problem.

And the safety of having a body that does something besides crumple. But what could be fixed with a dent puller will require the replacement of the entire panel in a crash and 3mm ss is not cheap.


There's some advantages, tooling costs are lower because you aren't pressing anything into shape you're cutting flat panels and welding them.

That's why John DeLorean chose the material in the first place.

Unfortunately, cocaine is a hell of a drug and financial mismanagement kills good idea.

Edit: I misspoke, you have to bend it at angles. Not necessarily right angles.

EV's are already insanely expensive to fix after a wreck. The CT is going to hit all of us in the wallet.

And I'm a bit ignorant on the subject, but I like the concept of crumple zones. They isolate the transfer of energy from the occupants. I'd imagine Tesla engineers figured out a way to make the CT as good or better than a standard car though, they're some of the best in the world.

 

[LordofallSocks]

EV's are already insanely expensive to fix after a wreck. The CT is going to hit all of us in the wallet.

And I'm a bit ignorant on the subject, but I like the concept of crumple zones. They isolate the transfer of energy from the occupants. I'd imagine Tesla engineers figured out a way to make the CT as good or better than a standard car though, they're some of the best in the world.

Crumple zones are awesome if the person that hits you is going the correct speed. Unibody construction is safer at most speeds and this is an evolution of that, Elon hires the best engineers on the planet, don't get it twisted.

 

[fatman76]

Crumple zones are awesome if the person that hits you is going the correct speed. Unibody construction is safer at most speeds and this is an evolution of that, Elon hires the best engineers on the planet, don't get it twisted.

sidenote

A high performer at my company left for Tesla a few years ago. He and I were often the last people here, guy worked hard and was good.

He lasted 90 days at Tesla. Said it was like working in the Thunderdome.

 

[LordofallSocks]

sidenote

A high performer at my company left for Tesla a few years ago. He and I were often the last people here, guy worked hard and was good.

He lasted 90 days at Tesla. Said it was like working in the Thunderdome.

IT in Silicon Valley is the same way you innovate, advance, or die.

 

[Capt Ron 1]

Tesla layoff fears mount as EV giant reportedly assessing which jobs are 'critical'

A report that Tesla is asking managers whether their subordinates' jobs are "critical" has sparked fears among the EV giant's employees that layoffs could be on the way.

www.foxbusiness.com

All of these companies are in trouble. The smarter public does not want this garbage

 

[fatman76]

Tesla layoff fears mount as EV giant reportedly assessing which jobs are 'critical'

A report that Tesla is asking managers whether their subordinates' jobs are "critical" has sparked fears among the EV giant's employees that layoffs could be on the way.

www.foxbusiness.com

All of these companies are in trouble. The smarter public does not want this garbage

Man that sucks…layoffs up 136% in January is not good news.

The tech sector is taking a beating.

I can tell you I’m worried - our demand cycle is off this year so far. It’s really early (seasonal business) but I’m starting to get concerned. The order file is light. If we don’t stuff the channel now we won’t be able to service a strong peak season. But if this is real demand it’s no bueno.

 

[Capt Ron 1]

Man that sucks…layoffs up 136% in January is not good news.

The tech sector is taking a beating.

I can tell you I’m worried - our demand cycle is off this year so far. It’s really early (seasonal business) but I’m starting to get concerned. The order file is light. If we don’t stuff the channel now we won’t be able to service a strong peak season. But if this is real demand it’s no bueno.

I keep waiting for the crash, it is coming

 

[fatman76]

I keep waiting for the crash, it is coming

Man I hope not.

Recessions do sometimes act like forest fires and clear out the waste, but people hurting is never a good thing. With inflation where it is a recession is going to be so much more impactful.

 

[fatman76]

I keep waiting for the crash, it is coming

Ford Scales Down EV Investment as Division Loses $4.7 Billion

Ford reduced the size of an existing plant in Michigan and delayed plans for a second battery plant.

www.theepochtimes.com

 

[BillytheC]

doesn’t appear the left’s climate bs is
going too well

Less than a year after Biden announced his EV push, industry shows his targets may be unobtainable

An analysis by energy expert Robert Bryce found that Ford Motor Company incurred an operating loss of its EV business in 2023 that exceeded its total profit for the year. The company lost $64,731 on every electric vehicle it sold last year.

justthenews.com

 

[fatman76]

 

[gatordad3]

 

[Mdfgator]

Big joe working for big oil and the trumpers. first we produce more oil and gas in our history, and now this??? WOW, i am sooo MAD...

 

[Capt Ron 1]

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Big joe working for big oil and the trumpers. first we produce more oil and gas in our history, and now this??? WOW, i am sooo MAD...

You are not smart enough to know what to be mad about, son.

 

[Mdfgator]

You are not smart enough to know what to be mad about, son.

can you believe how much oil and gas we produce as a nation?? its insanity. i am disappointed in big joe for giving into the rednecks and idiots that resist progress...

 

[fatman76]

View embedded media

Big joe working for big oil and the trumpers. first we produce more oil and gas in our history, and now this??? WOW, i am sooo MAD...

The best part of this post?

You’re admitting the gov’t is forcing the switch to EV’s.

I thought everyone wanted one?

You really need to be smarter with what you choose to post. You tell on yourself constantly.

 

[fatman76]

can you believe how much oil and gas we produce as a nation?? its insanity. i am disappointed in big joe for giving into the rednecks and idiots that resist progress...

The gov’t isn’t the one producing the oil and gas.

It’s called a “free market”.

It’s profitable to drill and refine and companies are choosing to fill the demand and make a profit.

We know you hate freedom and love mandates, after all you’re a Californian through and through. You just threw a fit and left when YOUR freedoms were infringed and you couldn’t play golf anymore. But you never seem to be upset when others lose their choices to govt mandates, like EV’s.

Don’t worry, a few more stolen elections and you won’t have anywhere to run to be free…

Liberals don’t care what you do as long as it’s mandated.

Just the tip, checkers boy.

 

[nail1988]

MDFR was this you in your tessy ? 🫣😳🤣

 

[Mdfgator]

The best part of this post?

You’re admitting the gov’t is forcing the switch to EV’s.

I thought everyone wanted one?

You really need to be smarter with what you choose to post. You tell on yourself constantly.

THE GOVERNMENT ISNT FORCING YOU, THEY ARE INCENTING GOOD BEHAVIOR, LIKE HOME OWNERSHIP VERSUS RENTING, MARRIAGE VERSUS SINGLE ETC ETC ETC. THE POINT of the post was that BIG JOE is removing some of the incentives to please the snowflakes that whine when somebody else is getting the stimi... COMICAL HOW DUMB YOU PEOPLE ARE!!!!

 

[Mdfgator]

the explosive growth in the EV industry is insane!!! what are the snowflakes missing????? why are they scared of ghosts?? why do they believe in the invisible man???? why does the invisible man always need your money???? HMMMMMMMMMMM

 

[fatman76]

THE GOVERNMENT ISNT FORCING YOU, THEY ARE INCENTING GOOD BEHAVIOR, LIKE HOME OWNERSHIP VERSUS RENTING, MARRIAGE VERSUS SINGLE ETC ETC ETC. THE POINT of the post was that BIG JOE is removing some of the incentives to please the snowflakes that whine when somebody else is getting the stimi... COMICAL HOW DUMB YOU PEOPLE ARE!!!!

You live in an alternate reality.

EPA fuel standards and EV percentage mandates are the govt forcing them down our throat.

EPA’s New Electric Vehicle Mandate: Too Far, Too Fast

Members of Congress are encouraged to sign letters to congressional leadership warning that unless the EPA creates a national greenhouse gas standard that is reasonable and achievable for all 50 states and stops attempting to ban the sale of gas-powered cars, Congress will need to step in.

www.nada.org

 

[Mdfgator]

You live in an alternate reality.

EPA fuel standards and EV percentage mandates are the govt forcing them down our throat.

EPA’s New Electric Vehicle Mandate: Too Far, Too Fast

Members of Congress are encouraged to sign letters to congressional leadership warning that unless the EPA creates a national greenhouse gas standard that is reasonable and achievable for all 50 states and stops attempting to ban the sale of gas-powered cars, Congress will need to step in.

www.nada.org

They do the same with mortgages homes marriage and kids idiot. They invent behavior they want. If you think gas is pricey here go to Europe Japan or any other civilized world. Stop swinging at ghosts.

 

[fatman76]

They do the same with mortgages homes marriage and kids idiot. They invent behavior they want. If you think gas is pricey here go to Europe Japan or any other civilized world. Stop swinging at ghosts.

No one is mandating people buy a house, or even a certain type of house. Incentives are not what I'm talking about, I'm talking about mandates.

The EPA fuel standards are insane. By 2026 automaker's fleet avg has to be 55mpg. That's impossible without hybrids or EV's.

So as @Capt Ron 1 points out, someone who actually works in the industry, this is leading automakers to force dealers to take EV's they don't want or they lose out on other, more popular, models.

Combine that with 13 states adopting CA's 100% EV sales mandate by 2035 and I'm not swinging at ghosts - the gov't is trying to force people to buy something they don't want to solve a fake global warming crisis.

When one side brings proof of their argument and the other is calling names...it's pretty clear who has won.

Do you ever get tired of being wrong?

New EPA Rule Mandates 55 MPG by Model Year 2026 | Center for Environmental Excellence | AASHTO

The Environmental Protection Agency is finalizing new federal greenhouse gas or GHG emissions standards for passenger cars and light trucks for model

environment.transportation.org

 

[Mdfgator]

No one is mandating people buy a house, or even a certain type of house. Incentives are not what I'm talking about, I'm talking about mandates.

The EPA fuel standards are insane. By 2026 automaker's fleet avg has to be 55mpg. That's impossible without hybrids or EV's.

So as @Capt Ron 1 points out, someone who actually works in the industry, this is leading automakers to force dealers to take EV's they don't want or they lose out on other, more popular, models.

Combine that with 13 states adopting CA's 100% EV sales mandate by 2035 and I'm not swinging at ghosts - the gov't is trying to force people to buy something they don't want to solve a fake global warming crisis.

When one side brings proof of their argument and the other is calling names...it's pretty clear who has won.

Do you ever get tired of being wrong?

New EPA Rule Mandates 55 MPG by Model Year 2026 | Center for Environmental Excellence | AASHTO

The Environmental Protection Agency is finalizing new federal greenhouse gas or GHG emissions standards for passenger cars and light trucks for model

environment.transportation.org

Nobody mandated me to buy an ev slim. They invent behavior they want. That’s nothing new. I have given you examples but you simply cannot stop swinging at the ghosts you see. Do you drive an ev? Do you fear that you won’t be able to buy a car in 10 years? I don’t worry about that or the climate killing me. Stop being so fearful and live your life. FYI, I despise stimi in any form, that’s my largest issue with the most fiscally deranged leader this country has ever seen. Your boy, DJT. I pay a lot of taxes. A LOT. We need a president that’s fiscally conservative to moderate not a banana lib that has no boundaries.

 

[fatman76]

Nobody mandated me to buy an ev slim. They invent behavior they want. That’s nothing new. I have given you examples but you simply cannot stop swinging at the ghosts you see. Do you drive an ev? Do you fear that you won’t be able to buy a car in 10 years? I don’t worry about that or the climate killing me. Stop being so fearful and live your life. FYI, I despise stimi in any form, that’s my largest issue with the most fiscally deranged leader this country has ever seen. Your boy, DJT. I pay a lot of taxes. A LOT. We need a president that’s fiscally conservative to moderate not a banana lib that has no boundaries.

Did I say you were forced to? Please find that quote from me. It's clear you're capable of making stupid decisions without anyone forcing your hand.

I said that's where we are headed and I provided proof.

This isn't a "stimi" it's a mandate. How is that concept so difficult for you? You have like 3-4 words and phrases you use over and over.

And no - I'll be able to buy a car because not every state is following CA's mandate and I usually buy used. But what it will do is jack up the price of used ICE vehicles because demand will outstrip supply.

And the space Trump takes in your head rent free is amazing to watch - point to the place on the doll where he touched you 😆

 

[Mdfgator]

Did I say you were forced to? Please find that quote from me. It's clear you're capable of making stupid decisions without anyone forcing your hand.

I said that's where we are headed and I provided proof.

This isn't a "stimi" it's a mandate. How is that concept so difficult for you? You have like 3-4 words and phrases you use over and over.

And no - I'll be able to buy a car because not every state is following CA's mandate and I usually buy used. But what it will do is jack up the price of used ICE vehicles because demand will outstrip supply.

And the space Trump takes in your head rent free is amazing to watch - point to the place on the doll where he touched you 😆

so you used your crystal ball is what youre saying??? yes eventually computers took over for the typwriter, there is nothing to be scared of my lil sheep!!!!

 

[Mdfgator]

@fatman76 this isnt necessarily about you.....

 

[fatman76]

so you used your crystal ball is what youre saying??? yes eventually computers took over for the typwriter, there is nothing to be scared of my lil sheep!!!!

What are you talking about?

It's basic high school economics.

If carmakers can no longer sell ICE vehicles in half the country, and those that they make have to average 55mpg+, and demand for ICE vehicles stays strong...what do you think that'll do to the used car market for ICE cars and trucks?

Did you eat lead paint chips as a kid?

 

[fatman76]

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@fatman76 this isnt necessarily about you.....

Dude, I've never said anything negative about Tesla. They are the one company that figured out early they needed to vertically integrate and hire the best engineers. While I think the CT is stupid, everything else they make has performance and style.

The problem is every other EV manufacturer is sucking wind. One company doesn't comprise an entire industry, or even a segment of one.

And the pros and cons of EV's don't work IMO. I think there's a better mousetrap if we'd get politics out of the way.

 

[Orangeclad]

so you used your crystal ball is what youre saying??? yes eventually computers took over for the typwriter, there is nothing to be scared of my lil sheep!!!!

What part of allowing normal market innovation and subsequent demand for EV's in lieu of mandates do you not get? Apparenly ALL of it. You are just dumb, man.

 

[Capt Ron 1]

Biden caves on another big initiative. He'll do anything to win in 2024

President Biden's White House made a policy change that popped up in the New York Times Sunday over the long holiday weekend. It's a surprise move that focuses on voters in Michigan

www.foxnews.com

Why would they do this with everyone wanting one of these unbelievable technology vehicles? LOLOL


Just another little note from someone who does this for a living. Our dealership will not take an EV in trade to keep for our lot. We call them out to wholesalers, because of the unbelievable expense that you can run in to with batteries. A dealer in our area got burned on a "tessie" that hit a bump and the cooling line(for the battery) broke. "Tessie" was going to charge the customer 15K to repair the problem, but he found some shade tree mechanic to do it for 750. Well they traded it in...and a dealer cannot sell the vehicle with a patch done on it like that...so they eat the 15K to repair it. That does not even count the customers that may have battery issues that instead of replacing a bad battery, take it to a dealer to trade it, and let it be THEIR problem. Now why I bring this up is because this will make trade in value much less when we wholesale something, than when we can retail a vehicle.

 

[Mdfgator]

Oil and gas industry doesn’t have a great future. The market sniffs reality, what’s wrong with fats and the rest of the sheep? What are they missing???