The end times

[GhostOfMatchesMalone]

I recently had a discussion with a friend about religion and the end times. It's on a lot of people's minds especially Christians right now.

My friend referenced a theory by a religious thinker (I cannot remember his name maybe @DCandtheUTBand or @Dr. Curmudgeon have an idea who it was) who posited that history is one long cycle.

The cycle is satan trying to bring about the Final Battle. He suggested that history was simply a long and continuous cycle of things getting worse and worse, then finally things move back from the edge and the Final Battle is averted or not its time. I believe the thinker suggested that World War II was the last time we had this cycle appear.

And if you remember, we had a snapback from World War II to a period of great prosperity in the United States for about 10-15 years. Then things slowly began to get worse and the decline has accelerated greatly in the last 20 years.

I believe this guy also suggested these current times will NOT bring about the Final Battle, and I believe that as well. Just curious if anyone else has heard of this theory, it has me interested in going back and studying world history to see if the cycle and rebound theory plays out. I suspect it does.

 

[BamaFan1137]

I've never heard that theory but I've long believed that is how "it" works or how it would work.

World history, and I've always been a history geek (especially over the last 500 years or so), absolutely seems to cycle and repeat.

We seem to forget...or maybe too many never knew or just believed "it's different this time" and that's the mechanism which allows us to repeat.

 

[BillCutting4585]

I recently had a discussion with a friend about religion and the end times. It's on a lot of people's minds especially Christians right now.

My friend referenced a theory by a religious thinker (I cannot remember his name maybe @DCandtheUTBand or @Dr. Curmudgeon have an idea who it was) who posited that history is one long cycle.

The cycle is satan trying to bring about the Final Battle. He suggested that history was simply a long and continuous cycle of things getting worse and worse, then finally things move back from the edge and the Final Battle is averted or not its time. I believe the thinker suggested that World War II was the last time we had this cycle appear.

And if you remember, we had a snapback from World War II to a period of great prosperity in the United States for about 10-15 years. Then things slowly began to get worse and the decline has accelerated greatly in the last 20 years.

I believe this guy also suggested these current times will NOT bring about the Final Battle, and I believe that as well. Just curious if anyone else has heard of this theory, it has me interested in going back and studying world history to see if the cycle and rebound theory plays out. I suspect it does.

Some would interpret the final battle as nuclear war which I do think is coming as China continues to advance its military might and anyone who disagrees with how they run things will die… world wide. The worst thing any developed nation allowed was China to enter the WTO. All they saw was money which equates to greed and as we know greed is a seven deadly sin.

However, until the second coming, wars are wars and not end times.

 

[DCandtheUTBand]

Maybe Jonathan Kahn or Perry Stone.

Satans goal is to destroy the Jews not engage in a final battle with God here on Earth.

Why he is deluded into thinking he can defeat the Creator of Ha Olam is beyond me.

He thinks by voiding the Abrahamic covenant that he will receive a get out jail card. He thinks God will allow him subvert what He swore upon His holy name? Come on man! Satan could kill every Jew and God would just resurrect them.

Christ has already come and won.

Satan is burning angel walking.

Genesis 17:7

I will establish My covenant between Me and you and your descendants after you throughout their generations for an everlasting covenant, to be God to you and to your descendants after you.

Genesis 17:19
But God said, “No, but Sarah your wife will bear you a son, and you shall call his name Isaac; and I will establish My covenant with him for an everlasting covenant for his descendants after him.

Psalm 105:8

He has remembered His covenant forever,
The word which He commanded to a thousand generations,

Psalm 111:9

He has sent redemption to His people;
He has ordained His covenant forever;
Holy and awesome is His name.

Luke 1:55

As He spoke to our fathers,
To Abraham and his descendants forever.”

Baruch attah Adonai Eloheynu Melek Ha Olam.

Baruch haba B'Shem Adonai

@GhostOfMatchesMalone

 

[Uniformed_ReRe]

This reminds me of the Fourth Turning.

Turnings[edit]​

While writing Generations, Strauss and Howe described a theorized pattern in the historical generations they examined, which they say revolved around generational events which they call turnings. In Generations, and in greater detail in The Fourth Turning, they describe a four-stage cycle of social or mood eras which they call "turnings". The turnings include: "The High", "The Awakening", "The Unraveling" and "The Crisis".[31]

High[edit]​

According to Strauss and Howe, the First Turning is a High, which occurs after a Crisis. During The High, institutions are strong and individualism is weak. Society is confident about where it wants to go collectively, though those outside the majoritarian center often feel stifled by the conformity.[38]

According to the authors, the most recent First Turning in the US was the post–World War II American High, beginning in 1946 and ending with the assassination of John F. Kennedy on November 22, 1963.[39]

Awakening[edit]​

According to the theory, the Second Turning is an Awakening. This is an era when institutions are attacked in the name of personal and spiritual autonomy. Just when society is reaching its high tide of public progress, people suddenly tire of social discipline and want to recapture a sense of "self-awareness", "spirituality" and "personal authenticity". Young activists look back at the previous High as an era of cultural and spiritual poverty.[40]

Strauss & Howe say the US's most recent Awakening was the “Consciousness Revolution,” which spanned from the campus and inner-city revolts of the mid-1960s to the tax revolts of the early 1980s.[41]

Unraveling[edit]​

According to Strauss and Howe, the Third Turning is an Unraveling. The mood of this era they say is in many ways the opposite of a High: Institutions are weak and distrusted, while individualism is strong and flourishing. The authors say Highs come after Crises, when society wants to coalesce and build and avoid the death and destruction of the previous crisis. Unravelings come after Awakenings, when society wants to atomize and enjoy.[42] They say the most recent Unraveling in the US began in the 1980s and includes the Long Boom and Culture War.[31]

Crisis[edit]​

According to the authors, the Fourth Turning is a Crisis. This is an era of destruction, often involving war or revolution, in which institutional life is destroyed and rebuilt in response to a perceived threat to the nation's survival. After the crisis, civic authority revives, cultural expression redirects towards community purpose, and people begin to locate themselves as members of a larger group.[43]

The authors say the previous Fourth Turning in the US began with the Wall Street Crash of 1929 and climaxed with the end of World War II. The G.I. Generation (which they call a Hero archetype, born 1901 to 1924) came of age during this era. They say their confidence, optimism, and collective outlook epitomized the mood of that era.[44] The authors assert the Millennial Generation (which they also describe as a Hero archetype, born 1982 to 2004) show many similar traits to those of the G.I. youth, which they describe as including: rising civic engagement, improving behavior, and collective confidence.[45]

Cycle[edit]​

The authors describe each turning as lasting about 20–22 years. Four turnings make up a full cycle of about 80 to 90 years,[46] which the authors term a saeculum, after the Latin word meaning both "a long human life" and "a natural century".[47]

 

[GhostOfMatchesMalone]

This reminds me of the Fourth Turning.

That setup definitely works for the time since WWII. Not sure the timing can be replicated in similar cycles before then.

BTW it's fascinating to think we had two world wars in a generation. Imagine the upheaval in the world to have two massive wars in the span of barely 20 years.

And @BillCutting4585 if the Axis win WWII, I think Germany effectively takes over Europe. And I think that gives them the resources to then attack the United States directly, and likely win.

Not sure we recover from hitler effectively ruling the world, and if we were to ever be in the end times, a person like him having that much power would seem to fit the bill.

 

[fsumc]

That setup definitely works for the time since WWII. Not sure the timing can be replicated in similar cycles before then.

BTW it's fascinating to think we had two world wars in a generation. Imagine the upheaval in the world to have two massive wars in the span of barely 20 years.

And @BillCutting4585 if the Axis win WWII, I think Germany effectively takes over Europe. And I think that gives them the resources to then attack the United States directly, and likely win.

Not sure we recover from hitler effectively ruling the world, and if we were to ever be in the end times, a person like him having that much power would seem to fit the bill.

A lot of truth here. As much as Germany’s military is marveled, to be sure they had tactics and strategies we use today, they were totally mismanaged and some really poor decisions made. We kicked the shit out of them but that’s because we value freedom and allowing our military leadership to have autonomy in the fight and planning. The Battle of the Bulge was a huge blunder for Hitler, poorly planned, and a plan based on hope because the retard ignored the basics of securing logistics throughout the war. Instead opting for headline victories which only last as long as your energy supplies do.

 

[Dr. Curmudgeon]

The great theologian Dr. Charles Spurgeon considered the latest great Apostle aside from Billy Graham recognized the start of the tribulation (7 years) as the gateway to the apocalypse. We shall not know of it's time for it will be like a thief in the night. Furthermore, Revelations are the final chapter of the bible for good reason, you must learn the Word and practice its obedience before you can truly understand Revelations. Has the earth been led by one ruler for 1,000 years? Rome fell after approximately 600 years and you have not seen a world leader for the next 400 years to reach the 1,000-year mark unless you count the Pope and that is a completely different analytical view of the topic.

One more item. I don't worry about such things as the rapture or apocalypse, I simply try to reach as many people as I possibly can and give them the great news of our Saviour Jesus Christ, for without his redeeming blood we are all in danger of perdition/damnation.

 

[kjfreeze]

I recently had a discussion with a friend about religion and the end times. It's on a lot of people's minds especially Christians right now.

My friend referenced a theory by a religious thinker (I cannot remember his name maybe @DCandtheUTBand or @Dr. Curmudgeon have an idea who it was) who posited that history is one long cycle.

The cycle is satan trying to bring about the Final Battle. He suggested that history was simply a long and continuous cycle of things getting worse and worse, then finally things move back from the edge and the Final Battle is averted or not its time. I believe the thinker suggested that World War II was the last time we had this cycle appear.

And if you remember, we had a snapback from World War II to a period of great prosperity in the United States for about 10-15 years. Then things slowly began to get worse and the decline has accelerated greatly in the last 20 years.

I believe this guy also suggested these current times will NOT bring about the Final Battle, and I believe that as well. Just curious if anyone else has heard of this theory, it has me interested in going back and studying world history to see if the cycle and rebound theory plays out. I suspect it does.

I've mentioned time and time again on here that history is cyclical and that if you go to the OT book of Habakkuk you'll see historically how Judah was and what happened to them via Babylon and this is exactly what is happening to us today. They had no justice system. The prophet Habakkuk complained about that to God and God's reply was, "Wait until you see what I do next. You will be amazed." Lots of people think it's a good thing, but God's reply was meant to show them increasing in their troubles. For almost 70 years this continued until it ended. That's why I do not see anything positive for the prospective future for America or the world. It's intent is to guide us heavenward-to seek out Jesus and not Trump as our Savior. I too do not believe we are to see "the rapture" or any appearance of Jesus Christ in our lifetime. Perhaps our kids, but not ours. I'm not pessimistic. I feel I'm more realistic.
If you have time, listen to this podcast when our preacher explains Habakkuk in relation to today: http://media.podhoster.com/redeemerchristian/habakkuk-1-02-28-21.mp3 This was in January, 2021.

 

[Mdfgator]

Seems reasonable and well thought out..... change is difficult for many.

 

[StevieBGator]

“Religious thinker” is an oxymoron. The whole concept of religion is predicated on people not thinking for themselves and just accepting something illogical on faith.

 

[kjfreeze]

“Religious thinker” is an oxymoron. The whole concept of religion is predicated on people not thinking for themselves and just accepting something illogical on faith.

Welp, I guess you think you provided a really cool, mind-blowing post, right? It's actually difficult to challenge your post because it's illogical in thought. Describe yourself better please.

 

[Dr. Curmudgeon]

“Religious thinker” is an oxymoron. The whole concept of religion is predicated on people not thinking for themselves and just accepting something illogical on faith.

Don't confuse philosophy with theology. You are dreaming/pondering and trying to find the key to life while the Word is giving you the key to abundant life on earth and life everlasting. Ponder on that?

 

[StevieBGator]

Welp, I guess you think you provided a really cool, mind-blowing post, right? It's actually difficult to challenge your post because it's illogical in thought. Describe yourself better please.

Atheist. My rabbi and family said God was real and I called BS. Thinking for myself, not believing because they said do. The entire concept of God is illogical to me.

For example, Judaism, Catholicism, Protestantism, Islam all basically believe in the same God. Yet, for centuries and centuries they have killed each other over different interpretations of HOW to believe in him. IF God, an all powerful and knowing being existed he wouldn’t want his children killing each other in his name. It wouldn’t be logical to abide that.

 

[Dr. Curmudgeon]

Atheist. My rabbi and family said God was real and I called BS. Thinking for myself, not believing because they said do. The entire concept of God is illogical to me.

For example, Judaism, Catholicism, Protestantism, Islam all basically believe in the same God. Yet, for centuries and centuries they have killed each other over different interpretations of HOW to believe in him. IF God, an all powerful and knowing being existed he wouldn’t want his children killing each other in his name. It wouldn’t be logical to abide that.

Ah, another freewill person that thinks fallible humans are not the problem, it's God's fault that we murder one another so there must not be a God. My Christian faith tells me that if you live by the sword you shall die by the sword. These other religions that denounce Jesus are not worshipping the same God as you pointed out, in fact, Jesus was God in Human form that died so that all people Jews/Gentiles may have everlasting life. Nowhere is there a mention of Mohammed, Buddha, or Mr. Smith.

 

[Mdfgator]

They don't call them flocks for nothing.

 

[martycat1]

Ah, another freewill person that thinks fallible humans are not the problem, it's God's fault that we murder one another so there must not be a God. My Christian faith tells me that if you live by the sword you shall die by the sword. These other religions that denounce Jesus are not worshipping the same God as you pointed out, in fact, Jesus was God in Human form that died so that all people Jews/Gentiles may have everlasting life. Nowhere is there a mention of Mohammed, Buddha, or Mr. Smith.

Jesus was God in human form? I must not be interpreting it right. How is that so if God gave his only begotten son. And the Trinity? Also in a earlier post, talking about the rapture. Where is rapture mentioned in the Bible?

 

[GhostOfMatchesMalone]

“Religious thinker” is an oxymoron. The whole concept of religion is predicated on people not thinking for themselves and just accepting something illogical on faith.

What's illogical is assuming that everyone else has had the same experience you have. Regarding religion or really any topic.

 

[GhostOfMatchesMalone]

They don't call them flocks for nothing.

Aethists have their own flocks. They all sit around and tell each other that they are right. It's like a support group.

Same thing they bash 'religious thinkers' for doing.

 

[Dr. Curmudgeon]

Jesus was God in human form? I must not be interpreting it right. How is that so if God gave his only begotten son. And the Trinity? Also in a earlier post, talking about the rapture. Where is rapture mentioned in the Bible?

John 10:30​

I and the Father are one.”
Most won't be raptured but they will not be here for the judgment from Christ. Those who see his judgment unfortunately will be judged and condemned to Hell along with the beast.
Those who are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not precede those who are dead (1 Thessalonians 4:15). The dead in Christ will resurrect first (1 Thessalonians 4:16). The living and the resurrected dead will be caught up together in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air (1 Thessalonians 4:17).

 

[martycat1]

John 10:30​

I and the Father are one.”
Most won't be raptured but they will not be here for the judgment of Christ. Those who see his judgment unfortunately will be judged and condemned to Hell along with the beast.
Those who are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not precede those who are dead (1 Thessalonians 4:15). The dead in Christ will resurrect first (1 Thessalonians 4:16). The living and the resurrected dead will be caught up together in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air (1 Thessalonians 4:17

You must not be quoting the KJV. John 10:30, says, I and my Father are one. Notice Father is capitalized. Just like your wife, you are considered one.

 

[BamaFan1137]

“Religious thinker” is an oxymoron. The whole concept of religion is predicated on people not thinking for themselves and just accepting something illogical on faith.

How very open minded of you.

 

[BamaFan1137]

Atheist. My rabbi and family said God was real and I called BS. Thinking for myself, not believing because they said do. The entire concept of God is illogical to me.

For example, Judaism, Catholicism, Protestantism, Islam all basically believe in the same God. Yet, for centuries and centuries they have killed each other over different interpretations of HOW to believe in him. IF God, an all powerful and knowing being existed he wouldn’t want his children killing each other in his name. It wouldn’t be logical to abide that.

Perhaps the issue is that you cannot imagine something being greater than yourself.

It sounds like you are a lot more hostile towards someone like me than I am towards someone like you. I wonder why that is?

 

[GhostOfMatchesMalone]

You must not be quoting the KJV. John 10:30, says, I and my Father are one. Notice Father is capitalized. Just like your wife, you are considered one.

Like on the verse, it's a link to the version he quoted.

 

[Dr. Curmudgeon]

You must not be quoting the KJV. John 10:30, says, I and my Father are one. Notice Father is capitalized. Just like your wife, you are considered one.

except my wife isn't God.

 

[martycat1]

except my wife isn't God.

That is not what I meant and you know that.

 

[martycat1]

Like on the verse, it's a link to the version he quoted.

You have no clue as to what we are talking about. This one is above your head.

 

[martycat1]

Revalation 22:19

 

[GhostOfMatchesMalone]

You have no clue as to what we are talking about. This one is above your head.

It might be, but that doesn't change the fact that you can click on the verse and see the source.

 

[GhostOfMatchesMalone]

That is not what I meant and you know that.

Why are you trying to pick a fight with two people who are being completely civil with you?

 

[2blades]

It`s really simple either believe in Jehovah or you won`t stay in Paradise or go join Jehovah in Heaven. Have faith and you will be saved.

 

[Mdfgator]

Aethists have their own flocks. They all sit around and tell each other that they are right. It's like a support group.

Same thing they bash 'religious thinkers' for doing.

Not bashing anyone, I have no issues with religious people so long as they don't use Their faith to be hateful. But the original sheep are the followers of religion, it is what it is.

 

[BamaFan1137]

Not bashing anyone, I have no issues with religious people so long as they don't use Their faith to be hateful. But the original sheep are the followers of religion, it is what it is.

The atheist used his lack of faith to be hateful ITT.

Unfortunately you liked that post.

 

[GhostOfMatchesMalone]

Not bashing anyone, I have no issues with religious people so long as they don't use Their faith to be hateful. But the original sheep are the followers of religion, it is what it is.

This may come across as a dig and I promise I do NOT intend it that way, but I feel so sorry for anyone that thinks the only reason why anyone believes in or follows God is because of faith.

I don't follow God because of faith, I follow Him because He has made Himself known to me.

But I asked Him into my heart first. I think that's the key, or a big part of it. I feel bad for people who don't have the same experience, but am grateful they still have the chance to have that.

 

[StevieBGator]

Perhaps the issue is that you cannot imagine something being greater than yourself.

It sounds like you are a lot more hostile towards someone like me than I am towards someone like you. I wonder why that is?

9/11, The Crusades, The Inquisition, The 30 Years War, The Arab-Byzantine Wars. I can go on and on with examples throughout history of war, violence and persecution in the name of religion and God.

Atheists might think people like you are wrong, naive and misguided but we’ve never waged war against you nor forced you to convert staring down the barrel of a gun.

I think people who believe in God ate wrong but I bear no hostility towards them individually. But yes, I think history has shown organized religion to be a means of control at best and inherently evil at worst.

To be clear you 110% have the right to practice ANY religion you want. FIRST AMENDMENT. I hate religion but I would be dead set against any Government action against religion. The Constitution is The Constitution. I fully support your Constitution right to be a fool.

 

[DCandtheUTBand]

John 1

1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2 The same was in the beginning with God.
3 All things were made by Him; and without Him was not any thing made that was made.
10 He was in the world, and the world was made through Him, and the world did not know Him.
14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

Exodus 3:14 And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you.

John 8: 58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I AM.

Zachariah 12:

9 And it shall come to pass in that day, that I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem.

10 And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplications: and they shall look upon me whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for him, as one mourneth for his only son, and shall be in bitterness for him, as one that is in bitterness for his firstborn.

(Note: in this verse God changes tense first he talks about Himself in the first person as having been pierced an then in the third person using him This is an end times prophecy concerning the Jews once they realize that Jesus was the Messiah the one they had pierced. )

Jesus said to the Jews:
Matthew 23 39 For I say unto you, Ye shall not see me henceforth, till ye shall say, Baruch Haba B'Shem Adonai

Blessed is He who comes in the name of Yahweh

Psalm 118:26 Blessed be he that cometh in the name of the Lord: we have blessed you out of the house of the Lord.

And as we end in Psalm I go down the rabbit hole and bring you Psalm 133



my favorite scene from the movie

 

[martycat1]

Why are you trying to pick a fight with two people who are being completely civil with you?

Sorry you took it that way Ghost. I was joking around with you.

 

[kjfreeze]

Atheist. My rabbi and family said God was real and I called BS. Thinking for myself, not believing because they said do. The entire concept of God is illogical to me.

For example, Judaism, Catholicism, Protestantism, Islam all basically believe in the same God. Yet, for centuries and centuries they have killed each other over different interpretations of HOW to believe in him. IF God, an all powerful and knowing being existed he wouldn’t want his children killing each other in his name. It wouldn’t be logical to abide that.

Well @StevieBGator , this may turn out to be fun. Atheist. You are suggesting you are an Atheist because of how religions fight each other? Seriously? You are playing God when you don't believe in God? You playing God and thinking what you believe God should do with religions if in fact there is a God. Before we go there, tell me how you came to exist? Don't run and hide now. Just answer the question. If you want to be so bold as to claim yourself an Atheist, we need to first step upon a foundation. How did you become you as a human being? Where did you come from? How did you come to even exist?

 

[kjfreeze]

Ah, another freewill person that thinks fallible humans are not the problem, it's God's fault that we murder one another so there must not be a God. My Christian faith tells me that if you live by the sword you shall die by the sword. These other religions that denounce Jesus are not worshipping the same God as you pointed out, in fact, Jesus was God in Human form that died so that all people Jews/Gentiles may have everlasting life. Nowhere is there a mention of Mohammed, Buddha, or Mr. Smith.

I agree totally. Christianity is the ONLY religion that claims their God died and rose from the dead. I don't know, have any of you seen Buddha lately? Seems any other religion has a leader that died and is not even worm food anymore. They are dust.

 

[Dr. Curmudgeon]

9/11, The Crusades, The Inquisition, The 30 Years War, The Arab-Byzantine Wars. I can go on and on with examples throughout history of war, violence and persecution in the name of religion and God.

Atheists might think people like you are wrong, naive and misguided but we’ve never waged war against you nor forced you to convert staring down the barrel of a gun.

I think people who believe in God ate wrong but I bear no hostility towards them individually. But yes, I think history has shown organized religion to be a means of control at best and inherently evil at worst.

To be clear you 110% have the right to practice ANY religion you want. FIRST AMENDMENT. I hate religion but I would be dead set against any Government action against religion. The Constitution is The Constitution. I fully support your Constitution right to be a fool.

The Bible isn't trying to control you, it is trying to evoke obedience with the Holy Spirit and guide you in a righteous living way. The Crusades are not a good example of Christ's Blood Covenant and if you are truly in discipleship with Jesus Christ you are showing grace and forgiveness towards others, even those that oppose you. Why are you reflecting on incidents that occurred in the Middle Ages? The Righteous Word of God is for everyone willing to live in obedience and care for the people that thirst for the Word.