Happy QAnon Inauguration Day 😂😂😂

[LizardGrad89]

After the Bush/Gore mess in FL, they figured it out. They ran a great election and had their results that night. Every state out their should be following FL's lead.

Florida did not have their results election night. Florida certified the election results on November 17th. They had to count all the mail in ballots before certification, same as everybody else. The difference is that Trump held enough of a lead that the mail in ballots couldn't change the election results, so the state was called for Trump that night. The news outlets calling a state is not the same as the election count being over. If it was, Al Gore would have been President in 2000.

This is something you need to understand. NO STATE EVER HAS RESULTS ON ELECTION NIGHT. EVER.

 

[LizardGrad89]

PA receiving ballots late wasn't the issue, them subverting the state legislature and the Constitution, was.

ANY state with ANY issue should be investigated.

I've never heard a single Trump voter say otherwise. I've also never seen a single Biden voter say this. Every Biden supporter claims there are no issues and let's move on.

Nope. Cheating is cheating. Fair and free elections are worth fighting for.

See my response to Bill Cutting on the election law lie. I see you believe it as well.

 

[LizardGrad89]

LMAO!

You literally invent an entire argument for another poster, then detail in a wall of text how their argument (which they never made and which you invented on the fly for them) was wrong.

And for good measure, you then accuse two other posters of lying about claims they never made either.

That's special. Count every vote!

You, sir, are an idiot. It's not even worth speaking to you. Good Day.

 

[LizardGrad89]

Now one area in Florida that needs to be figured out is Duval County. No way in hell Biden won in that county.

If you look at the two elections for US Rep, you will see that if you add the totals together for each party, they are almost exactly the totals for president. Duval is not really a red county, despite the outsized number of rednecks it contains.

What's odd is the state representative voting, where neither party got anywhere near the total number of votes that the federal elections got. Maybe not all state reps were up for election? Dunno.

Summary Results - Election Night Reporting

enr.electionsfl.org

 

[BillCutting4585]

I assume you mean this:

Article 1 Section 4
The Times, Places and Manner of holding Elections for Senators and Representatives, shall be prescribed in each State by the Legislature thereof; but the Congress may at any time by Law make or alter such Regulations, except as to the Places of chusing Senators.

But equally I see you do not understand it.

Nothing in 1-4 gives state legislatures any special powers. This is the merely and only the sharing of authority over federal elections with states. Nowhere in there does it say that state legislatures have any authority over elections different from their authority over laws in general. Now, the simple concept of our state governments is that they mirror the federal level: Legislature makes laws, Governor signs or vetoes laws, State Supreme Court interprets the laws. But it's not that simple. Governors also have the authority to put out Executive Orders, which is a way to alter laws.

So, think about election laws like any other law, because they are. Can Governors change aspects of laws through EO's? Yes. Can Supreme Courts reinterpret election laws or throw out parts they say are unconstitutional? Yes. Did those things happen before this election? They did. Did the governors and state supreme courts have the authority to do those things? They did.

One of the repeated lies on this board is the one that election laws are special, that legislatures write them and nobody else can say anything. Sunshine loves that lie, as does Curmudgeon. But that's what it is, a lie. Just look at Florida as an example. Florida Legislature had for decades refused to allow felons to ever get their voting rights back. Wouldn't even discuss it. So a Constitutional Amendment was passed in 2018 to allow felons to get their voting rights back after they served their time. Note that if only the Legislature was allowed to make election laws, this amendment would have never made the ballot, but evidently there can be provisions in the state constitution that override the Legislature. Then the Legislature passed a law that felons could only get their voting rights back if their paid their restitution first, which almost no felons are ever able to do, which basically invalidated the constitutional amendment. But then the Florida Supreme Court declared that law unconstitutional, and threw it out. Again, if only the legislature has authority over elections, then the state supreme court wouldn't have had that ability. But it seems they did. What does this mean? That the Article 1 Section 4 argument is flawed and invalid.

I've given up hope for Sunshine and Curmudgeon, but still hoping you have enough sense left to see a truth when it hits you in the face.

Define State by the Legislature

Article 1 Section 4
The Times, Places and Manner of holding Elections for Senators and Representatives, shall be prescribed in each State by the Legislature thereof; but the Congress may at any time by Law make or alter such Regulations, except as to the Places of chusing Senators.

 

[GhostOfMatchesMalone]

Florida did not have their results election night. Florida certified the election results on November 17th.

Counting the votes and certifying the votes aren't the same thing.

 

[GhostOfMatchesMalone]

See my response to Bill Cutting on the election law lie. I see you believe it as well.

I wouldn't even begin to try to hazard a guess at what you see. I do know that you see saying 'count every vote' as being honest. That pretty much tells me all I need to know about your vision.

 

[GhostOfMatchesMalone]

If you look at the two elections for US Rep, you will see that if you add the totals together for each party, they are almost exactly the totals for president. Duval is not really a red county, despite the outsized number of rednecks it contains.

What's odd is the state representative voting, where neither party got anywhere near the total number of votes that the federal elections got. Maybe not all state reps were up for election? Dunno.

Not sure how any of that has anything to do with @gatordad3's claim, but ok.

 

[LizardGrad89]

Define State by the Legislature

Article 1 Section 4
The Times, Places and Manner of holding Elections for Senators and Representatives, shall be prescribed in each State by the Legislature thereof; but the Congress may at any time by Law make or alter such Regulations, except as to the Places of chusing Senators.

I see you still don't understand. Election laws are not special, they are laws same as all the other laws, and the legislature has the same authority over them as all laws. No more, no less.

 

[LizardGrad89]

Define State by the Legislature

Article 1 Section 4
The Times, Places and Manner of holding Elections for Senators and Representatives, shall be prescribed in each State by the Legislature thereof; but the Congress may at any time by Law make or alter such Regulations, except as to the Places of chusing Senators.

Hope this helps:

The Elections Clause is the primary source of constitutional authority to regulate elections for the U.S. House of Representatives and U.S. Senate. The Clause directs and empowers states to determine the “Times, Places, and Manner” of congressional elections, subject to Congress’s authority to “make or alter” state regulations. It grants each level of government the authority to enact a complete code for such elections, including rules concerning public notices, voter registration, voter protection, fraud prevention, vote counting, and determination of election results. Whenever a state enacts a law relating to a congressional election, it is exercising power under the Elections Clause; states do not have any inherent authority to enact such measures.

See, what this is telling us is that this section of the constitution is authorizing the states to make laws about federal elections. It's not granting special powers to anybody. Do you get it now?

Edit: Interestingly, it doesn't actually say anything about electing the President or the Electoral College, so I suppose technically this clause has nothing to do with that.

Interpretation: Elections Clause | The National Constitution Center

constitutioncenter.org

 

[GhostOfMatchesMalone]

It's not granting special powers to anybody. Do you get it now?

He didn't say anything about 'special' laws or powers. You did. Then claimed he did. Then argued that his claim was wrong.

I think we all get it. I even think you do.

 

[BillCutting4585]

I see you still don't understand. Election laws are not special, they are laws same as all the other laws, and the legislature has the same authority over them as all laws. No more, no less.

Can voting officials change or circumvent voting laws?

yes or no is all that is required here

 

[greyghost14]

I agree but no more voting machines just paper ballots that were filled out in person with signatures verified.

I’m ok with tabulators as long as they cannot be tampered with by being hooked up to the internet. I’d also take the actual adjudication process out of the person operating the tabulator. Let another set of eyes verify votes that the tabulator wasn’t able to verify as good with representatives from both parties being present.

So .....

........

 

[kalimgoodman]

Article 1 Section 4:
The Times, Places and Manner of holding Elections for Senators and Representatives, shall be prescribed in each State by the Legislature thereof; but the Congress may at any time by Law make or alter such Regulations, except as to the Places of chusing Senators.

1. By the above excerpt from the US Constitution, it clearly is legal and constitutional for the US Congress to pass voting laws. (Funny that you make arguments from this section of the US Constitution but have no idea what it actually says.)

2. There is no such thing as "ballot harvesting". That's a Republican term designed to make something innocuous sound sinister. What it is, is ballot collection, and it's nothing more than a third party picking up a completed and sealed ballot and carrying it to the post office or the polling place. You ever heard of meals on wheels? That's a way we get food to people who aren't mobile enough to get it on their own. But you would make it illegal for people who can't get around enough to feed themselves to get help getting their vote in? You are a true Republican.

But yes, I know, that's an extreme (yet very real) example. While it is absolutely a way to help those who can't get around do to a lack of personal or vehicle mobility, it's also a way to get out the "lazy" vote, the vote of people who can't be bothered to get up and out and do what's needed. But I checked the constitution, and didn't see any penalties in there for being lazy, so evidently they have the same right to vote as the rest of us, and if it takes somebody stopping by their house to get their ballot and take it in for them, I don't see the problem. Oh, sure, I've heard the Republican complaints of "fraud", but what I've learned about Republicans and voting over the years is anything that helps them they say is needed, and anything that goes the other way they call fraud. Without any evidence of actual fraud, mind you.

Yes Ballot harvesting is a republican term. Just like chain migration and anchor babies haha

 

[LizardGrad89]

Can voting officials change or circumvent voting laws?

yes or no is all that is required here

What, in your mind, is a voting official?

Can the supervisor of elections change the laws? I wouldn't think so, but then, I never heard about that happening. I did hear complaints about governors and courts, though.

Can Governors? Yes, within their scope as governor for any state law. Can Supreme Courts? Yes, within their scope as Supreme Court for any state law.

 

[GhostOfMatchesMalone]

Yes Ballot harvesting is a republican term. Just like chain migration and anchor babies haha

And just like abortion is 'healthcare'?

If there's nothing wrong with allowing political operatives to collect votes from others and take them to the polling station (which is what ballot harvesting is), then let's pass a law that says only REPUBLICAN operatives can do this.

We all know you and Captain 'count every vote' would scream and howl. Which proves the point that ballot harvesting DOES open the door to voter fraud.

Which captain 'count every vote' has clarified he is fine with. As long as it helps his guy.

 

[kalimgoodman]

And just like abortion is 'healthcare'?

If there's nothing wrong with allowing political operatives to collect votes from others and take them to the polling station (which is what ballot harvesting is), then let's pass a law that says only REPUBLICAN operatives can do this.

We all know you and Captain 'count every vote' would scream and howl. Which proves the point that ballot harvesting DOES open the door to voter fraud.

Which captain 'count every vote' has clarified he is fine with. As long as it helps his guy.

I don't care who takes the ballot and hand them in, as long as I can confirm that my vote was counted. You do know the ballots have tracking numbers right and you can confirm that your vote was casted correctly? (Well some states). HR1 would require all states to allow that. So I ask, if you can confirm your vote was casted correctly, and track it, what's the issue with ballot harvesting as you call it?

 

[GhostOfMatchesMalone]

I don't care who takes the ballot and hand them in, as long as I can confirm that my vote was counted. You do know the ballots have tracking numbers right and you can confirm that your vote was casted correctly? (Well some states). HR1 would require all states to allow that. So I ask, if you can confirm your vote was casted correctly, and track it, what's the issue with ballot harvesting as you call it?

I don't call it ballot harvesting, that's what it is.

What does it mean to harvest? To collect and take to another place to use. That's precisely what is being done here.

The issue is that anytime you let a 3rd party, especially a 'political operative' handle your vote, it opens the door to voter fraud.

The best way to reduce voter fraud us:

1 - Have every person who is eligible to vote, show an ID that proves their identity

2 - Have every person who is eligible to vote, vote in person


These two things greatly reduce the chance of voter fraud. It's telling that the dems go out of their way (vote by mail! ballot harvesting is cool! Requiring an ID to vote is voter suppression!) to demonize the things that reduce the risk of voter fraud, and embrace the things that encourage it.

We should all want free and fair elections.

 

[BamaFan1137]

We interrupt the information differently. I do think the anti-Trump vote was strong too.

So...just because you say so? That's solid logic.

Way more people voted for Biden than Obama. There's not much left there to interpret.

 

[BamaFan1137]

Yes Ballot harvesting is a republican term. Just like chain migration and anchor babies haha

Meaning they don't exist? They're made up?

 

[instaGATOR]

Dominion Voting Machines were the traitorous Hillbillery's answer to getting bitch-slapped and shown the door in 2016.

And 15-20 states, including every one of the 'swing states' had from 100% to 120% vote totals compared to the legally registered voter roll totals.... (dead-underage-out of state-felons-etc voting, mostly by mail-in)

The 2020 ELECTION FRAUD is not even in question, for anyone that's not either brain-dead, or a corrupt/evil Rat. My vote no longer means squat because traitors to the Constitution now own us peasants, (for the moment). The traitors STOLE the election, and now they just stole 2 Trillion from us and our children, to fund their anti-American, anti-Constitution Socialist Agenda.

In old England, only the Kings knights were allowed to possess swords, and that's the primary reason that the founders included the 2nd Amendment, in order to protect a FREE states sovereign citizens.
Sport shooting and hunting are only minor side benefits, but not the reasons for the right to keep and bear arms.

Also, the arms were to be the equivalent to what the Military possessed at the time, so telling today's citizens that they don't 'NEED' an assault weapon is an outright lie. The founders never intended the government 'SERVANTS' to have better arms than the 'SOVEREIGN' citizens that they were supposed to be serving. Only evil tyrants want that.

The Constitution, including the 2nd Amendment, doesn't give me any rights, those are God given and unalienable. What it does is specifically limit the government from interfering with my God given rights.

Rabbits and traitorous snowflake cowards always volunteer for slavery, but now they are trying to demand that I also accept their form of slavery with their cancel culture crap. Not gonna happen....
The 1st Amendment is my shield, and the 2nd Amendment is my sword. 🤓

Oh BTW, I haven't a clue who or what QAnon is, but if they are on the side of the Constitutional limits on government, then the enemy of my enemy is my friend.

 

[BCSpell]

What, in your mind, is a voting official?

Can the supervisor of elections change the laws? I wouldn't think so, but then, I never heard about that happening. I did hear complaints about governors and courts, though.

Can Governors? Yes, within their scope as governor for any state law. Can Supreme Courts? Yes, within their scope as Supreme Court for any state law.

Can the State Supreme Court change on its own accord, or does it have to a case brought before them?

 

[BillCutting4585]

Can the State Supreme Court change on its own accord, or does it have to a case brought before them?

Bradley can’t follow simple yes or no questions, good luck with your deflection answer 😂😂😂

 

[BCSpell]

I am against voter collecting or whatever term you want to call it. Voting is very important and shouldn’t be taken lightly. It’s your civic duty and privilege as a citizen to participate in the governing of this country. If your too lazy or to busy, you don’t deserve to vote in my opinion. If there are other reasons, then request an absentee ballot. How do you know this third party person is actually turning in your vote or that they are not altering it some way.
Kalim says ballots are trackable so you can confirm your vote. But by the time your vote is counted, you go online to confirm, the election is over. If there is a problem, it’s too late. Even if you could get a hold of an election official, and they are able to search through and find your ballot, the state had probably already certified. Voting in person is the only true way to know your vote was counted.

 

[jfegaly]

Counting the votes and certifying the votes aren't the same thing.

he is doing what he has always done. His character is hot garbage. It just is.

 

[NavigatorII]

Yes Ballot harvesting is a republican term. Just like chain migration and anchor babies haha

Maybe, because CNN doesn't want to talk about it? All 3 of them are VERY real.
In respective order:
Preying on the old or stupid and pretending to represent voters, allowing just anyone into the country just 'cause cousin J(H)esus is in the fold, or some puta dumped her litter on the correct side of the latitude parallel are VERY REAL.

Those ARE facts.

There's no making this shit up.

 

[kalimgoodman]

Meaning they don't exist? They're made up?

They 100% exist and no I'm not saying I support/agree with them. I'm just saying that the right is good at creating names for things and it sticks. Like Obamacare, trickle down economics and now cancel culture.

 

[NavigatorII]

I see you still don't understand. Election laws are not special, they are laws same as all the other laws, and the legislature has the same authority over them as all laws. No more, no less.

The fvck they are. Obviously not. Just like federal immigration laws not followed by sanctuary states and cities. . Just like those, they were completely ignored.
All laws are equal, just some laws are more equal than others.

 

[LizardGrad89]

The fvck they are. Obviously not. Just like federal immigration laws not followed by sanctuary states and cities. . Just like those, they were completely ignored.
All laws are equal, just some laws are more equal than others.

I would have thought even a frog with a gun could understand the difference between lawmaking and law enforcement. I stand corrected.

PS I see we can add Animal Farm to the list of things you don't understand.

 

[BillCutting4585]

I would have thought even a frog with a gun could understand the difference between lawmaking and law enforcement. I stand corrected.

PS I see we can add Animal Farm to the list of things you don't understand.

 

[GhostOfMatchesMalone]

he is doing what he has always done. His character is hot garbage. It just is.

I still remember back in November or December when we were discussing how the dems were stealing the election. We were discussing how all machines should be audited or something along those lines. One of the Hiden supporters, either @LizardGrad89 or @Uniformed_ReRe pointed out what they thought was a massive 'gotcha' moment for republicans.

They asked if we had ever thought that if we checked everyone for cheating that SOME of the people cheating would be REPUBLICANS! That was incredibly telling, because they thought if we found OUR GUYS cheating, that we would want to DROP looking into cheating.

In other words, they thought we would react the same way they do. We don't. The Hiden supporters here are fine with cheating, as long as it helps their guy win.

The Trump supporters here are not. We want free and fair elections. We know that 'count every vote!' is saying you condone voter fraud IF....it helps your guy win.

Everyone here knows if we had the same proof that Trump tried to steal the last election, that @LizardGrad89 would drop his 'count every vote!' mantra in an instant.

Situational ethics is such a horrible look.

 

[GhostOfMatchesMalone]

I would have thought even a frog with a gun could understand the difference between lawmaking and law enforcement. I stand corrected.

PS I see we can add Animal Farm to the list of things you don't understand.

Animal Farm, that was the book with the sheep that bleated out whatever the pigs said, right?

 

[LizardGrad89]

Anytime any of you wishes to understand Animal Farm, you have but to ask, I will graciously explain it to you. I can also do the difference between law enforcement and lawmaking, but I don't want the Malone's of the world complaining about a "wall of text" when there's a bit of reading to do. There's no point to putting in the effort to write something useful only to have people not read it because it's too long for them and overheats their brains.

 

[jfegaly]

Anytime any of you wishes to understand Animal Farm, you have but to ask, I will graciously explain it to you.

just stick to numbers

 

[BCSpell]

Anytime any of you wishes to understand Animal Farm, you have but to ask, I will graciously explain it to you.

I would love to hear your interpretation of Animal Farm.

 

[NavigatorII]

Animal Farm, that was the book with the sheep that bleated out whatever the pigs said, right?

4 legs good, 2 legs better! Bahahahahhahaha

 

[NavigatorII]

I would have thought even a frog with a gun could understand the difference between lawmaking and law enforcement. I stand corrected.
PS I see we can add Animal Farm to the list of things you don't understand.

I see it is you who does not. Written by a former socialist who saw the fallacies of his indoctrination.
The moral of the story is the destruction of capitalism serves only to enrich a select few under the guise of equitable distribution. I hope you are better at numbers than grasping so simple a concept.

 

[GhostOfMatchesMalone]

Anytime any of you wishes to understand Animal Farm, you have but to ask, I will graciously explain it to you.

So the sheep wants to explain to us what the pigs meant. I think I read this in a book, somewhere.

 

[LizardGrad89]

I would love to hear your interpretation of Animal Farm.

Briefly then. (Ok, not so briefly, but I really tried for briefly)

Many people think Animal Farm is anti-Communism. It is not.

See, it all starts with every farm having a farmer. Then the animals kick Farmer Jones out. Since Animal Farm is an allegory for Russia, that's ending the rule of the Czar's. Then the animals form a "worker's utopia" (using a term from the Communist Manifesto), and are briefly happy, but ultimately end up having basically replaced one farmer with another when the pigs rise up and take power. Granted, the Stalin/Lenin/etc regime in Russia was far worse than the Czars ever were, but in the story, the end is that the animals can no longer tell the pigs from the farmers, as they are now all basically the same.

See, Animal Farm is anti-Royalist. Or to be more specific, anti-ruling class. It is actually pro-communist, in that in the brief time the animals have communism, they are happy and the farm runs well. However, it also tells us that the reality of human existence is that there are always those who lust for power, and when there is a power vacuum, the most ruthless will rise to the top. So that communism, true communism, ultimately, is unworkable. It also explains very clearly that what the pigs bring isn't communism, it's a repressive authoritarian government that calls itself communist.

That's why I said Navi doesn't understand Animal Farm, because he is the biggest "Commie hater" on the board, and then he uses a pro-communism book as a meme.

 

[LizardGrad89]

I see it is you who does not. Written by a former socialist who saw the fallacies of his indoctrination.
The moral of the story is the destruction of capitalism serves only to enrich a select few under the guise of equitable distribution. I hope you are better at numbers than grasping so simple a concept.

Yep, you don't get it. See above.