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Why does it seem like Harris regresses more and more with every game he plays?

sadgator

sadgator

Bull Gator
Jan 9, 2002
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Copper Monkey 30 minutes prior to kickoff
it is so strange. When he first replaced Grier he seemed to have a certain confidence he was playing with and a chip on his shoulder. He now seems like he has no confidence and is completely lost. Is the line's lack of pass blocking just getting to him? He even looks scared and uncertain on designed roll outs now. Grady must be real horrible, because sadgator would have absolutely yanked Harris at the beginning of the second half yesterday. Thank goodness Mac is the coach and not sadgator.
 
Grady transferred from Vandy after not playing. Vandy's QB didn't do squat yesterday. That right there tells you what Grady is capable of.
 
I think its a lot of things. One, the timing just clearly isn't there. Two, the pass rush is starting to get to him it looks like (understandably). Three, the coaches started out well with play calling but then that regressed also. And three, to your point, he just doesn't seem to trust what he's seeing. He tries to guide the ball sooooo much which leads to a lot of his inaccuracy. Like dude just throw the damn thing. Look at the last two drives yesterday, when he planted his back foot and just threw the ball he completed a couple of nice strikes on the sideline. They were accurate, on time, and gave the receiver a chance to run after the catch. He can do it, he's just inconsistent as hell.

I'm really starting to get down on the play calling though. We started out really good yesterday by spreading it out and hitting the quick slants, drags, etc. and we moved up and down the field the first two or so drives even though we didn't capitalize. But from that point on the play calling sucked. First, just about every drive we would run that slow developing counter play or try to go deep and time after time on 1st and it left us in 2nd and long way too often. It's really amateur hour. Our line is not good enough to run such a slow developing play and when we try to take a deep shot we can't hold up so it's pointless calling it. The worse part is that whenever we did throw on 1st we automatically ran on 2nd with no variation, we were very predictable. So they would run blitz us and then get us in 3rd and long and just tee off on us.

Nuss did not call a good game yesterday. They're overthinking it just as much as Treon seems to be. Why the constant rollouts? All it does is cut the field in half and shrink the windows you have to throw into. It should be in the package of plays but not every damn passing play. It's almost like they have this belief that Treon can't throw from the pocket. Ironic thing is that his three best throws yesterday all came from him standing in there and gunning it. It's becoming obvious to me based on what we call in the game that they don't work on that with him in practice which is probably why it's not progressing at the rate it should.
 
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Grady couldn't even start at QB at Vandy. And you saw Vandy's QB yesterday.

Harris is the best we got right now until Grier's suspension is up/Luke Del Rio is eligible/Feleipe Franks or other high school prospect is enrolled.
 
The play calling has been good just about every game except for yesterday. Everybody had an off game. But Harris needs to make the simple throws as well.

I said it all offseason and all this season. Harris is not an accurate passer. Never has been and never will be. Since he's been the starting QB his completion percentage is under 50%. There is a reason for that. He's not an accurate passer at all. Not sure why that is so hard for some to grasp and understand.
 
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PacoGator19 said:
Grady couldn't even start at QB at Vandy. And you saw Vandy's QB yesterday.

Harris is the best we got right now until Grier's suspension is up/Luke Del Rio is eligible/Feleipe Franks or other high school prospect is enrolled.
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Luke Del Rio is at UF?
 
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Del Rio is awful, there's zero chance he takes a snap at UF as a starter, none.
 
oozie7 said:
Del Rio is awful, there's zero chance he takes a snap at UF as a starter, none.
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Not from what I have heard. Mac and Nuss like him and have been impressed with him. He would have beaten out Harris for the backup job if he was eligible. I've heard this from multiple people and even some players.
 
I'll trust my eyes. Del Rio walked on at Bama, transferred to Oregon St. and then got zero playing time prompting another transfer. That's not an SEC caliber QB. If he starts we'll have a minimum of 2 losses before Grier gets back.
 
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Rushie said:
As he plays more games and opposing DCs have more film......makes sense.
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This is very true as well. Teams are taking away the few things he can do. Since he's limited in what he can do it is easy for defenses to shut him down. For example the rollouts aren't working much anymore. They are putting a spy on Harris as well.
 
TennesseeGator said:
I thought his teammates "responded well to him"?

I'd hate to see them not respond well if yesterday was responding well.
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Back in September there was quite a bit of grousing by some folks in the Alley when Grier took over as the starter. But the farther we've gotten from the LSU game, seems there are fewer and fewer of them posting.
 
oozie7 said:
I'll trust my eyes. Del Rio walked on at Bama, transferred to Oregon St. and then got zero playing time prompting another transfer. That's not an SEC caliber QB. If he starts we'll have a minimum of 2 losses before Grier gets back.
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The reason he transferred from OSU was because after Riley left, the new coach runs a spread & he is a drop-back/pro-style QB.
 
Just saying from everybody Inhave talked too Del Rio has looked good. Again these same people said he would have beaten out Harris for the backup job. With that being said beating out Harris probably isn't saying much.
 
Treon is what he is, a good athlete with quick feet who throws a pretty nice deep ball but struggles with accuracy on the short stuff. That being said we should enjoy the fact we are 8-1, East Champs still in the playoff conversation and going to play in a very good bowl game. Nobody expected that in a rebuilding year with new coaching staff and a freshman QB who then gets suspended. Great year and going to get better.
 
I'm sure people have been impressed with him throwing with no pass rush and not being able to be hit like it typically goes in practice. I'm not taking that at face though. These are the same people who swore year after year that Driskel was shredding our defense in practice and set to break out.
 
oozie7 said:
I'm sure people have been impressed with him throwing with no pass rush and not being able to be hit like it typically goes in practice. I'm not taking that at face though. These are the same people who swore year after year that Driskel was shredding our defense in practice and set to break out.
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No. Totally different people as it is a totally different coaching staff and secondary staff.
 
We were projected mid-Division in preseason. Many felt 7 or 8 wins given everything that's gone on would be a tremendous accomplishment. At 8 and upwards of 11 before SEECG is still a possibility.

That said, we better be prepared and do a much better job of protecting the ball against Carolina. Yes, they've had some bad losses. But they were in a position to win or at least tie in Knoxville before fumbling in the final seconds and they lost by a TD at A&M. And they won't be as limited offensively as Vandy was/is. Although on the flip side their D isn't as good.
 
I know Harris is no Tom Brady, but one thing to consider in evaluating him is the fact that he has played three of the top defenses in the SEC.
 
GatorGray said:
I know Harris is no Tom Brady, but one thing to consider in evaluating him is the fact that he has played three of the top defenses in the SEC.
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Meh, yes and no. LSU, UGA, and Vandy were are stout against the run. LSU and Vandy were able to stuff the run forcing us into long down and distances all game, but we ran all over UGA. And LSU was by far his best performance throwing. Given our success running against UGA, he was just awful. Vandy is somewhat understandable given the o-line play yesterday, but he was still really bad at times. Not as bad as people think IMO, but still bad.
 
I said 7-9 wins in the preseason.
I said 10+ wins was possible, but everything would have to work out perfect.
(injuries and Grier being the most important imo --- so not perfect right now)

They should get at least the 9 wins now, with 10-11 still possible, but not likely with the current roster imoho.
The 9-11 wins with the SECe-C is excellent for 1st year Mc-staff.
I can't see them winning the SEC-C vs Bama without the 2nd coming of Grier.
If they manage a good bowl win to go with their SECe-C, then it's amazing.

Dare I say it? Jus-waitalnexyear.... :cool:
 
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LizardGrad89 said:
Don't we have some Oline injuries?
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That was the most god awful display yesterday of offense since the crazy eyes day. We were Muschamping on the offensive side of the ball all day long. I kept thinking we'd wake the eff up and every possession would look like the last. God must have been smiling on the Gators because nothing went right. Treon looked like a first time starter, the O line was a turnstile. The dentist missed an extra point. The offense was even worse than the Missouri game last year if that is even possible.

The zebras did every conceivable thing they could to kiss Derek Mason's ass. They effectively screen blocked on Vandy's only touchdown. They blew targeting calls and non fumbles. I for sure was convinced the game was being played in Tuscaloosa and not Ben Hill Griffin Stadium.


Yet we won............I kept watching the camera pan on Mac, he never came unglued. I was and was a little pissed he wasn't. I would have gone postal on the officials. Hope he can get the line healthy and Treon's head out of his ass. Harris is bolting the pocket WAY too early and running right into sacks on his own instead of stepping up and looking downfield before taking off. So much to be pissed about, and yet we survived. This won't get it done against USC or the little sister savages.
 
LizardGrad89 said:
Don't we have some Oline injuries?
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We do. I'm sure it played a role but man...they were just getting whipped. I think the play that sums up their play was the one where Scarlett lost like 20 yards. The left tackle got driven into the backfield like 4 yards, it was embarrassing. I can understand struggling, but stuff like that was just unacceptable.
 
Just read that myself. Interesting that all 12 of his completions were from the pocket.
 
I mentioned in this thread that he can throw from the pocket. The last two drives be three at least 3 beautiful strikes to receivers. The coaches are overthinking it with these roll outs. Why would he learn to hang tough in the pocket consistently when they're rolling him out every other play? It's just bad strategy because it cuts the field in half and shrinks his passing Windows. I keep telling people that it hasn't been THAT bad, it's just when it is it looks really ugly.
 
Also two other things caught my eye mainly because I commented on it in the game thread. The 4th down play where I actually said it was the smart play. We went max protect and had a 1-man route so he only had three options there with the pass rush in the backfield instantly. Throw it away (which would be dumb because it's 4th down), run for the 1st which wasn't happening, or throwing it up and trying to have your guy make the play. Good to see Mac touch on that. Said the same thing in the game thread and everyone jumped all over it.


Also like where Mac points out the protection issues. I think it was you MJ who mentioned a few times we had hots on and I honestly didn't see it on those particular plays. Mac said it best, he had no chance back there. Likewise with the quick drags and slants that I mentioned we went away from. We burned Vandy's blitzes on those earlier in the game then just scrapped em. Idk why. That would have held their linebackers if we kept going to those.
 
None of this makes him a more accurate passer. That is still IMO his biggest weakness.
 
NavigatorII said:
That was the most god awful display yesterday of offense since the crazy eyes day. We were Muschamping on the offensive side of the ball all day long. I kept thinking we'd wake the eff up and every possession would look like the last. God must have been smiling on the Gators because nothing went right. Treon looked like a first time starter, the O line was a turnstile. The dentist missed an extra point. The offense was even worse than the Missouri game last year if that is even possible.

The zebras did every conceivable thing they could to kiss Derek Mason's ass. They effectively screen blocked on Vandy's only touchdown. They blew targeting calls and non fumbles. I for sure was convinced the game was being played in Tuscaloosa and not Ben Hill Griffin Stadium.


Yet we won............I kept watching the camera pan on Mac, he never came unglued. I was and was a little pissed he wasn't. I would have gone postal on the officials. Hope he can get the line healthy and Treon's head out of his ass. Harris is bolting the pocket WAY too early and running right into sacks on his own instead of stepping up and looking downfield before taking off. So much to be pissed about, and yet we survived. This won't get it done against USC or the little sister savages.
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Anger stops thought. I don't want him angry. I want him busy outscheming the other guy. However, I think he needs to start challenging some of this crap. You can review a spot, After a couple of bad spots get fixed, the refs will start calling it straight.
 
It seems to be a number of things...Treon can do some good things but he's limited...but if he wasn't our best option then he wouldn't be in there. Coaches need to do a better job, o line play yesterday was horrible and yes Treon needs to play much better...Treon is a gamer but he is not consistently accurate...he can do some good things but he will need better play call and line play around him to be more productive. Truth is players have to execute plays too that wasn't done yesterday on the field. It is what it is but the good thing is that our coaches have shown that they are smart enough to review every angle of the game, coach the kids up and try to not make the same mistakes again.
 
PacoGator19 said:
None of this makes him a more accurate passer. That is still IMO his biggest weakness.
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Well no one is claiming he's some super accurate passer, but yea all of that would affect a QB's accuracy. Not being able to set your feet, being forced out the pocket with a pass rush, being hit while throwing, throwing with a moving pocket (which is hard even for really good QB's to do), etc all would affect accuracy. That's no excuse for some of his passes, like the terrible screen passes, but that doesn't mean we gotta ignore everything happening around the QB and act like it's all him either. That's not reality.
 
oozie7 said:
Well no one is claiming he's some super accurate passer, but yea all of that would affect a QB's accuracy. Not being able to set your feet, being forced out the pocket with a pass rush, being hit while throwing, throwing with a moving pocket (which is hard even for really good QB's to do), etc all would affect accuracy. That's no excuse for some of his passes, like the terrible screen passes, but that doesn't mean we gotta ignore everything happening around the QB and act like it's all him either. That's not reality.
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Can't blame him for having happy feet, every other pass play is a jailbreak on the QB. However, he's terrible at short throws. I was watching one particular play Saturday and told my brother watch this, the left edge is coming and he's got a hot read coming for a big play. The tight end lets the edge rusher blow by and the end drifts into the left flat WIDE OPEN. Harris took the shotgun snap and was either not aware of the coverage or freaked out and didn't even attempt to toss it out the the wide open receiver. Instead he tried to duck under and got absolutely snuffed. It was terrible. It looked like a called play to suck in the outside edge guy and then he blows the hot read. This kind of crap happened all day. I give the line half the credit to the abysmal showing and half to Harris, with a a portion of Harris's issues to some of the roll outs called.
 
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