If you can watch this and still vote for Trump....

[instaGATOR]

What "Mod" are you referring to??? I'm only a mod on the free board. Report this thread to Corey if you don't like it.

Only because you have asked so nicely....

This thread began on the Blue Brd on Monday Aug 17.

I posted my question on the following day, Tuesday Aug 18
(ocala also posted on Aug 18)

Don't have a clue which Mod (if any) finally moved this thread to the Lounge., as it certainly should have been immediately on Monday.
==========

I do know who LOCKED OUT (instead of moving the thread to the Lounge) my 'Players Holding Out' thread.

I did a cut & paste to bring the thread to the Lounge and re-post it, instead of letting it just die locked out on the BLUE board.
Even locked out, my thread was around 200 reads before it was finally 'disappeared' from Rivals Blue.

Currently in the Lounge, the Holding Out thread is at 207 reads with 11 reply's.

JMOHO here, but raw porn on the Blue board was intentionally used to get a Mod there.

That was done so that the Mod could then censor anything that they didn't like, instead of just being a needed Porn filter.
And that's why the Holding Out thread was (politically) locked out.

If that's not true, then what was the specific reason for locking out the thread....

 

[BSC911]

Well when you have single payer care who decides what treatment someone gets. Is it the patient and doctor or is it a government bean counter? When its single payer and gubmint run what will wait times be? Will they improve or get worse?

I look at myself and see that I may need a lifesaving treatment in about 20-25 years ( age and statistics) and be told because of age to go home and take a pain pill. So instead of living into my 90s my life could be cut short by 20 years or more due to bean counters. What of the 90 year old in need of heart surgery? Could he live to 120 or could he die at 91? I really don't want some 20 something bean counter reading stats deciding whether someone gets treatment and putting a value on life based on age . Rationed care is not care especially when delays can be the difference between life and death.

My standard for any HC law is that the patient and doctor make the decisions and the persons taking the premium pays the bill, period. There should not be 3rd party interference in life saving or treatment efforts.

Docs and payers can haggle over price AFTER they have saved me or a loved ones life ,NOT BEFORE.

Anything short of that is IMHO wrong whether its private or gubment aka single payer.

Good luck with getting insurance at age 91 without being on a government, ie single payer system. And I even if you were willing to pay the premiums, good luck with getting any for profit insurance company to pay for ia heart transplant either. That would be like buying life insurance at that age. It’s never just between you and your doctor.

It sounds like you want your cake and eat it too.

 

[BSC911]

Only because you have asked so nicely....

This thread began on the Blue Brd on Monday Aug 17.

I posted my question on the following day, Tuesday Aug 18
(ocala also posted on Aug 18)

Don't have a clue which Mod (if any) finally moved this thread to the Lounge., as it certainly should have been immediately on Monday.
==========

I do know who LOCKED OUT (instead of moving the thread to the Lounge) my 'Players Holding Out' thread.

I did a cut & paste to bring the thread to the Lounge and re-post it, instead of letting it just die locked out on the BLUE board.
Even locked out, my thread was around 200 reads before it was finally 'disappeared' from Rivals Blue.

Currently in the Lounge, the Holding Out thread is at 207 reads with 11 reply's.

JMOHO here, but raw porn on the Blue board was intentionally used to get a Mod there.

That was done so that the Mod could then censor anything that they didn't like, instead of just being a needed Porn filter.
And that's why the Holding Out thread was (politically) locked out.

If that's not true, then what was the specific reason for locking out the thread....

LOL. You and your conspiracy theories.

 

[BSC911]

A single-payer system will subject physicians to unwanted and unnecessary oversight by government in health care decisions. With the newfound power to benchmark physicians and regulate payments, the government will inevitably restrict the use of potentially beneficial therapies and pay differentially for perceived differences in quality, with potential unintended consequences such as increased health care disparities (5). Without price competition from private insurers, the government will be free to pay whatever it wants for health services. Physicians are already inadequately reimbursed for services provided under Medicaid (6), and reductions in Medicare reimbursement over the years have demonstrably affected access and quality of care in a variety of health care venues (7–10). Even lower physician payments under single payer will drive many physicians out of business, further restricting access to care. Decreased reimbursement will also prevent hospitals from investing in new health care technologies or trying innovative new therapies (11). Allowing government, rather than the free market, to set health care prices is a dangerous proposition.

full text https://www.atsjournals.org/doi/full/10.1164/rccm.200906-0882ED


My daughter is a OBGYN resident(fourth year) and has worked her butt off for TWELVE years and she and other physicians do not need Nancy and Chuck telling her she is making too much money and how much she can charge. I need a specific type of biopsy for my newly found prostate cancer and i will be damned if I will let the government tell me where and who to see. Single payer will allow a government which has allowed itself to go over 20 trillion dollars in debt and spends millions on immoral investigations to control my decisions on medicine. In the meantime the libs want us to trust them...... NEVER!

Yeah, because physicians should be able to charge whatever they want, with no oversight. What makes them so special?

 

[GatorNation79]

Would you like a list of the lies and dumb things Trump has said?

Bigger idiot.

Yeah well I have no time for that...if you think Trump is a bigger idiot does that excuse someone who has the worst district in the country? I live close to California so maybe you're not informed.

 

[GatorNation79]

Pelosie and company have unscrupulous behavior...why isn't she in her district and in Washington all of the time? San Fran is an absolute embarrassment to America...I won't go there until it changes. Lots of people feel like that and who love the city.I've been there and people sleeping all over the streets....tent cities all over the place but she's serving her people?

 

[instaGATOR]

It sounds like you want your cake and eat it too.

Much more than just a want.
I'm keeping my FREEDOM to choose that the Rat 'cake-eaters' are always attempting to deny me from having...

Thomas Jefferson -- "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." (all enemies, foreign & domestic)

 

[DCandtheUTBand]

Good luck with getting insurance at age 91 without being on a government, ie single payer system. And I even if you were willing to pay the premiums, good luck with getting any for profit insurance company to pay for ia heart transplant either. That would be like buying life insurance at that age. It’s never just between you and your doctor.

It sounds like you want your cake and eat it too.

This is america and not europe. You guys will reap the whirlwind by subverting the culture. What happens in a culture based on individual freedoms when it become atheistic? Well look at insta post and he believes in God. Wait until some old white man atheist gets told to go home and die. It inevitable that a man told by the right that he has a right to life and the left a right to healthcare and lives in a culture based on individual freedoms who also does not believe in an afterlife, will show back up and kill as many as he can on the way out the door.

That lawyer that killed the judges son last month had terminal cancer. Atheist believe they have NOTHING to lose.

Keep devaluing life , removing religion from society and see how much more violent this country will become.

 

[GhostOfMatchesMalone]

Pelosie and company have unscrupulous behavior...why isn't she in her district and in Washington all of the time? San Fran is an absolute embarrassment to America...I won't go there until it changes. Lots of people feel like that and who love the city.I've been there and people sleeping all over the streets....tent cities all over the place but she's serving her people?

@BSC911 is on record saying Gay Bay is one of the nicest cities in the country. Birmingham puts it to shame and Bham is a toilet.

 

[BlueEyedGator17]

View embedded media

Lol. Are u serious?? Haha.

 

[BSC911]

This is america and not europe. You guys will reap the whirlwind by subverting the culture. What happens in a culture based on individual freedoms when it become atheistic? Well look at insta post and he believes in God. Wait until some old white man atheist gets told to go home and die. It inevitable that a man told by the right that he has a right to life and the left a right to healthcare and lives in a culture based on individual freedoms who also does not believe in an afterlife, will show back up and kill as many as he can on the way out the door.

That lawyer that killed the judges son last month had terminal cancer. Atheist believe they have NOTHING to lose.

Keep devaluing life , removing religion from society and see how much more violent this country will become.

Your post didn’t address a single point I raised.

There’s nothing preventing you from getting your heart transplant at 91. Just don’t expect me to pay for it.

 

[LizardGrad89]

oh okay.

well since you say so.

case closed.

So FSU numbers can say "it won't work" with nothing else, but I can't respond in kind? Seems fair.

 

[DCandtheUTBand]

Your post didn’t address a single point I raised.

There’s nothing preventing you from getting your heart transplant at 91. Just don’t expect me to pay for it.

Wait ?

Are you for universal care? If so, you want to tax people all their lives and then not give them care when they need it because of their age?

So you dont have to "pay for it?"

Well you will be paying something (taxes) for maybe nothing and your fine with it being you denied care when you need it?

Yep just another socialist ponzi scheme.

Better idea, insurance has to offer you a plan regardless of age and at the same rate as everyone else. They have to pay upfront and can appeal. If they win the doc or hospital NOT the patient pays them back. They will have to compete with each other to get the largest pool possible in order to make a profit and cover their risks.

 

[LizardGrad89]

I don't disagree at all about your insurance companies being in the pockets off congress. But in my humble opinion single payer only works if everyone contributes. It would be nearly impossible to make that happen in the US. Personally I like the Japanese approach. Seems to combine some of the better features of social and free market.

It's called Medicare expansion, and it will work. Insurance companies are in bed with hospitals and doctors. Having the government be a single payer takes that away. Reasonable rates can be applied, and skyrocketing drug costs can be curtailed. Did you ever wonder how pharmacies can charge so much less in other countries? Because we pay way too much. Look at this as an example:

https://khn.org/morning-breakout/pe...-drug-cost-75-in-africa-and-39000-in-america/

Just as an FYI, Obamacare didn't cause a spike in medical costs. Medical costs went up because our aging overweight country got older and fatter. Which is just going to continue. We need to change the way we handle medicine in this country.

 

[LizardGrad89]

Wait ?

Better idea, insurance has to offer you a plan regardless of age and at the same rate as everyone else. They have to pay upfront and can appeal. If they win the doc or hospital NOT the patient pays them back. They will have to compete with each other to get the largest pool possible in order to make a profit and cover their risks.

This only works if you have (and pay for, or have paid for you) health insurance your whole life. This is why we need single payer. Single payer is lifelong insurance, paid for through taxes. If you let people just sign up whenever, the old guy will wait until he needs the heart transplant before getting insurance. The transplant costs 100K, but he's only paid in $500. That's not going to work.

 

[LizardGrad89]

A single-payer system will subject physicians to unwanted and unnecessary oversight by government in health care decisions. With the newfound power to benchmark physicians and regulate payments, the government will inevitably restrict the use of potentially beneficial therapies and pay differentially for perceived differences in quality, with potential unintended consequences such as increased health care disparities (5). Without price competition from private insurers, the government will be free to pay whatever it wants for health services. Physicians are already inadequately reimbursed for services provided under Medicaid (6), and reductions in Medicare reimbursement over the years have demonstrably affected access and quality of care in a variety of health care venues (7–10). Even lower physician payments under single payer will drive many physicians out of business, further restricting access to care. Decreased reimbursement will also prevent hospitals from investing in new health care technologies or trying innovative new therapies (11). Allowing government, rather than the free market, to set health care prices is a dangerous proposition.

full text https://www.atsjournals.org/doi/full/10.1164/rccm.200906-0882ED


My daughter is a OBGYN resident(fourth year) and has worked her butt off for TWELVE years and she and other physicians do not need Nancy and Chuck telling her she is making too much money and how much she can charge. I need a specific type of biopsy for my newly found prostate cancer and i will be damned if I will let the government tell me where and who to see. Single payer will allow a government which has allowed itself to go over 20 trillion dollars in debt and spends millions on immoral investigations to control my decisions on medicine. In the meantime the libs want us to trust them...... NEVER!

You are terribly wrong in this.

But I will say that part of single payer will have to be malpractice reform. A doctor's single biggest cost each year is malpractice insurance and that has to change.

Another huge cost is the administrative paperwork dealing with all the different insurance companies and their forms. Going to single payer will greatly simplify that and require far fewer administrative staff and corresponding costs. Anyone who scoffs at the idea of the government having simpler paperwork, just consider that it would only be one set of paperwork, where doctors can take 20 or 30 different health insurances, each with their own forms and rules. Even in the government has a very complex set of rules and forms, it would still be better than 20 sets.

BTW, I have friends who are doctors. None of them is "inadequately funded". That's a load of crap. For example, I know an Orthopaedic Surgeon who makes about 700K a year. Seems fairly adequately funded to me.

Oh, and I have to laugh at the whole "I'll be damned if I let the government tell me what doctor I can see". Does Medicare specify a doctor? It does not. So there's the lie already.

 

[LizardGrad89]

This is america and not europe. You guys will reap the whirlwind by subverting the culture. What happens in a culture based on individual freedoms when it become atheistic? Well look at insta post and he believes in God. Wait until some old white man atheist gets told to go home and die. It inevitable that a man told by the right that he has a right to life and the left a right to healthcare and lives in a culture based on individual freedoms who also does not believe in an afterlife, will show back up and kill as many as he can on the way out the door.

That lawyer that killed the judges son last month had terminal cancer. Atheist believe they have NOTHING to lose.

Keep devaluing life , removing religion from society and see how much more violent this country will become.

Note: This is not a country founded on religion. It is founded on ideals. That's why the central document isn't the bible, it's the constitution.

You know, you can have a moral code without a religion, and you can have a religion without a moral code.

 

[LinksGator]

Yeah, because physicians should be able to charge whatever they want, with no oversight. What makes them so special?

A free market system does not flourish if the government sets the “quota”. So yes any business or financial entity should be able to charge whatever they want and the free market will make them go broke or be successful. Try to get adequate medical care in England where there is no incentive to be good or efficient.The oversight is the market not the government. Why is Northern Virginia so affluent? The government feeds its own. Move to effing Venezuela or Cuba if you want the government controlling your life. Libs just can not understand that government is the problem not the solution. My daughter has lived at the poverty line for 12 years while learning to be a great doctor, she has delivered over 550 babies for basically nothing other than the love of her profession and I will stand against any one that says Nancy, Joe, or Chuck can tell her what to “charge”. This country was founded by those that knew government was best when it was tiny and provided only security and equality.

Physicians are not special but neither are you or me. EVERY CITIZEN can “set their own course” .

 

[martycat1]

A free market system does not flourish if the government sets the “quota”. So yes any business or financial entity should be able to charge whatever they want and the free market will make them go broke or be successful. Try to get adequate medical care in England where there is no incentive to be good or efficient.The oversight is the market not the government. Why is Northern Virginia so affluent? The government feeds its own. Move to effing Venezuela or Cuba if you want the government controlling your life. Libs just can not understand that government is the problem not the solution. My daughter has lived at the poverty line for 12 years while learning to be a great doctor, she has delivered over 550 babies for basically nothing other than the love of her profession and I will stand against any one that says Nancy, Joe, or Chuck can tell her what to “charge”. This country was founded by those that knew government was best when it was tiny and provided only security and equality.

Physicians are not special but neither are you or me. EVERY CITIZEN can “set their own course” .

That was a double Bingo.

 

[BamaFan1137]

What makes them so special?

Not sure if serious.

I can charge whatever I like for my wares. I defy you to try and stop me Mr. Marx. I will likely make more money if my prices are competitive...and that's why my prices are my prices.

I'll find a good book on free market systems and link it for you later.

 

[GatorNation79]

@BSC911 is on record saying Gay Bay is one of the nicest cities in the country. Birmingham puts it to shame and Bham is a toilet.

Gays have nothing to do with it bro...the government is the issue. I live a few of hours from there and know lots of people that will not visit there. It's gross. I was there recently and the homeless situation is out of control...while Nancy Peloscy and the the dip shit Gavon N is out talking their trash Nationally.

 

[GhostOfMatchesMalone]

Your post didn’t address a single point I raised.

Critical thinkers don't waste their time engaging idiots.

 

[GhostOfMatchesMalone]

Note: This is not a country founded on religion. It is founded on ideals. That's why the central document isn't the bible, it's the constitution.

See @BSC911? No point engaging.

 

[LizardGrad89]

Not sure if serious.

I can charge whatever I like for my wares. I defy you to try and stop me Mr. Marx. I will likely make more money if my prices are competitive...and that's why my prices are my prices.

I'll find a good book on free market systems and link it for you later.

Should highways be privately owned? How about the army? Should we have a for-profit armed forces? Should you have water and sewer companies competing for your business?

When you are sending him that book on the free market, look up this thing called a "public good". Healthcare, when understood properly, is a public good.

 

[GatorNation79]

This is america and not europe. You guys will reap the whirlwind by subverting the culture. What happens in a culture based on individual freedoms when it become atheistic? Well look at insta post and he believes in God. Wait until some old white man atheist gets told to go home and die. It inevitable that a man told by the right that he has a right to life and the left a right to healthcare and lives in a culture based on individual freedoms who also does not believe in an afterlife, will show back up and kill as many as he can on the way out the door.

That lawyer that killed the judges son last month had terminal cancer. Atheist believe they have NOTHING to lose.

Keep devaluing life , removing religion from society and see how much more violent this country will become.

I could are less if you believe in God nobody is talking about that but you.

 

[GatorNation79]

Should highways be privately owned? How about the army? Should we have a for-profit armed forces? Should you have water and sewer companies competing for your business?

When you are sending him that book on the free market, look up this thing called a "public good". Healthcare, when understood properly, is a public good.

You tell your boy Obama about that then he left his senate area rot like it did and did nearly nothing for his state and the black community? You did nothing but sit around and call out Republicans while your boy failed his community. The new Nancy Pelocy and still taking crap after being a POTUS. Nobody does that.. Let's be real. Get off crack or put together something that matches up with reality. Geez...did you start following this in the last few months?

 

[GatorNation79]

Should highways be privately owned? How about the army? Should we have a for-profit armed forces? Should you have water and sewer companies competing for your business?

When you are sending him that book on the free market, look up this thing called a "public good". Healthcare, when understood properly, is a public good.

I would love to see that book. You're not interested in free markets.

 

[BSC911]

Not sure if serious.

I can charge whatever I like for my wares. I defy you to try and stop me Mr. Marx. I will likely make more money if my prices are competitive...and that's why my prices are my prices.

I'll find a good book on free market systems and link it for you later.

Sure, send me your favorite. Which one is it? I have a rom full of them. Or you could come to one of the seminars that I teach on the subject.

Health care is the farthest thing we have from a free market. It should be obvious why, but I’ll have to address later since I have an early tee time.

 

[Ncgatr1]

Yep I’m still voting for Trump, and so is my family, and most people I know.

 

[JIMBO1313]

I would like to know what this crap is doing on our Gator board. There are people on here I have never heard from This is more like the crap that was on the "main" board. Aside from the fact I don't like the format, if this post is what we can expect in the future, count me gone. Comment from someone who is in the know from RIVALS please so I can make my decision to stay or leave,.......jim

 

[JIMBO1313]

Yep I’m still voting for Trump, and so is my family, and most people I know.

That doesn't make you real intelligent in my opinion.......jim

 

[Ncgatr1]

That doesn't make you real intelligent in my opinion.......jim

Opinions of idiots are irrelevant to me.

 

[LinksGator]

Sure, send me your favorite. Which one is it? I have a rom full of them. Or you could come to one of the seminars that I teach on the subject.

Health care is the farthest thing we have from a free market. It should be obvious why, but I’ll have to address later since I have an early tee time.

Please send me the information on your seminars I would like to attend and I will be the guy in the back wearing black and a mask with a brick and the banner reading DEFUND SEMINARS.

 

[fatman76]

Biden gropes little girls.

Required viewing to vote for Biden...the whole thing

 

[fatman76]

Should Tara "Reade " this?

Who is that person? I think she may have been canceled and financially ruined.

Do you even fascism bro?

 

[GhostOfMatchesMalone]

View embedded media

 

[kjfreeze]

Critical thinkers don't waste their time engaging idiots.

The little agreeable laugh icon is BS! Here is how I like to show it:

 

[GhostOfMatchesMalone]

I would like to know what this crap is doing on our Gator board. There are people on here I have never heard from This is more like the crap that was on the "main" board. Aside from the fact I don't like the format, if this post is what we can expect in the future, count me gone. Comment from someone who is in the know from RIVALS please so I can make my decision to stay or leave,.......jim

Ummmm.....this is the off topic board. We'll make do without you, I suspect.

 

[ndemos]

Terrible tragedy but poor girl is getting used. I don’t think
Trump ever said to go to bars for karaoke. These
libs are not cases. Trump all the way! Restore law and order.

 

[Sunburnt Indian]

Opinions of idiots are irrelevant to me.

Ncgatr1 can clearly define math's simplest equation? Can his opponent? With such knowledge there is no debate.