Recruiting issues with Coach Mac and his staff - are we in big trouble moving forward?

[Gator Fever]

Recruiting not going so well looking at the Rivals rankings:

There are 15 schools that have more blue chippers (5 and 4 star recruits) combined than us right now.

7 other schools in the SEC have more blue chippers in this recruiting class right now than us. 3 of them are fellow East teams and a 4th is LSU who we play every year. Since Smart got to Georgia he has been pulling in blue chippers galore so if he gets the coaching part down just a little bit that is going to be a huge issue for us moving forward.

Muschamp at SC of all places has more blue chippers committed right now than us.

You are not going to have good long term results in the SEC when your recruiting classes are around 8th out of 14 teams in the SEC. This doesn't even take into account missing out on blue chippers in our biggest areas of need.

Even if Mac was a real good game day coach in the SEC which hasn't been the case with his offense I doubt we could overcome the recruiting deficit to truly be a threat to win the SEC. The East isn't going to stay piss poor forever.

 

[instaGATOR]

are we in big trouble moving forward?


In a word, (so that everyone else might read it) ----- NO

 

[Gator Fever]

are we in big trouble moving forward?


In a word, (so that everyone else might read it) ----- NO

Many probably disagree with that. I cant think of any modern SEC Champion that wasn't doing real good in recruiting in some years prior to winning the SEC except that 2010 Auburn team there might be an argument but they had a QB that had one of the best college seasons ever for a QB that year.

 

[Dannygator1989]

I keep being pleasantly surprised by the young guys on both sides of the ball.

They may help for a while if that holds true.

Something has to happen I. The next 9 weeks though.

A new OC could be a nice shot in the arm.

 

[MJWilliamson]

Many probably disagree with that. I cant think of any modern SEC Champion that wasn't doing real good in recruiting in some years prior to winning the SEC except that 2010 Auburn team there might be an argument but they had a QB that had one of the best college seasons ever for a QB that year.

Yea, this is becoming a disturbing trend

 

[Michi-Gator]

Two ways to win a national title:

1. Land a once in a generation QB: Newton, Winston, Vince Young

2. Recruit the best of the best EVERY year: Saban, Meyer, Carroll

 

[Michi-Gator]

I keep being pleasantly surprised by the young guys on both sides of the ball.

They may help for a while if that holds true.

Something has to happen I. The next 9 weeks though.

A new OC could be a nice shot in the arm.

I think with a new offensive philosophy Mac could flip this in two years. But I mean dumping his philosophy and hiring a Helfrich/Kiffin type.

And yes, Reese and Jospeh have looked very, very good. Cleveland will be very good, I like Perine and Scarlett and even a few OL. And Callaway is a stud.

 

[Dannygator1989]

Two ways to win a national title:

1. Land a once in a generation QB: Newton, Winston, Vince Young

2. Recruit the best of the best EVERY year: Saban, Meyer, Carroll

Carroll ran out of town on the heels of heavy sanctions.

 

[Michi-Gator]

Carroll ran out of town on the heels of heavy sanctions.

Agree, cheated to a point Saban and Meyer look clean. But it waa the way he got there by recruiting elite classes. Honestly, of all the examples I mentioned only Vince Young is not based on shady circumstances. But thats a whole issue itself

 

[Dannygator1989]

I think with a new offensive philosophy Mac could flip this in two years. But I mean dumping his philosophy and hiring a Helfrich/Kiffin type.

And yes, Reese and Jospeh have looked very, very good. Cleveland will be very good, I like Perine and Scarlett and even a few OL. And Callaway is a stud.

Oddly, Helfrich came to mind for me earlier today.

I think he falls under the "great offensive mind but can't handle the whole program" type coach.

He may be my top choice for OC right now.

 

[Michi-Gator]

Oddly, Helfrich came to mind for me earlier today.

I think he falls under the "great offensive mind but can't handle the whole program" type coach.

He may be my top choice for OC right now.

Well you know damn well he is my first choice,so I guess we agree on something.

And I know Kiffin isn't realistic, but he is a Chria Petersen type offensive mind.

 

[Gator Fever]

I keep being pleasantly surprised by the young guys on both sides of the ball.

They may help for a while if that holds true.

Something has to happen I. The next 9 weeks though.

A new OC could be a nice shot in the arm.

A few I am but most teams have some 3 stars they can point that out. I think we are too quick sometimes to think some people are destined for greatness also. Case in point those young defenders we were raving about against LSU. Watch some of their play against FSU and they definitely showed they aren't ready for prime time yet. They are very young however.

 

[Dannygator1989]

They're yoing and getting valuable experience that will be useful for next year.

 

[Gator Fever]

They're yoing and getting valuable experience that will be useful for next year.

That is a big plus for the defense going into next year.

 

[TexanNole]

Recruiting at a high level is a MUST!

 

[instaGATOR]

Recruiting at a high level is a MUST!

Granted. The problem with that is that high level recruits (demonstrated on the field) are not always the 'highest rated' by the recruiting services.

High level recruiting, is not necessarily the same thing as, Top Ranked Classes.

And as everyone should know by now, recruiting is another game that is not played on a level field.

 

[oozie7]

I don't even care about stars really...it's about filling needs. Things like not signing a DT last year and then only having 1 commit this year at that spot are what concern me. Polite is gonna end up there though so if everything holds from now till signing day we would have signed 1 DT in 3 classes. Next year I count 6 returning linebackers, we play 3 at a time so we'll have enough for a 2-deep only not counting injuries which almost always happens at that position. Things like that are what's troublesome.

 

[Michi-Gator]

I don't even care about stars really...it's about filling needs. Things like not signing a DT last year and then only having 1 commit this year at that spot are what concern me. Polite is gonna end up there though so if everything holds from now till signing day we would have signed 1 DT in 3 classes. Next year I count 6 returning linebackers, we play 3 at a time so we'll have enough for a 2-deep only not counting injuries which almost always happens at that position. Things like that are what's troublesome.

Not to mention its a numbers game. Callaway is much better than a 3*. Jake Allen is a fraud of a 4*. But all the outliers aside, higher percentages of 4* and 5* recruits will still work out more often then not (see Saban and Meyer).

You can build decent teams and depth with 3* players but need some elite kids to put you to championship level. Cleveland and Scarlett were both 4* recruits. I think Tabor was a 5*. So if you look at it we still place our hopes with a lot of the higher ranked kids.

 

[instaGATOR]

2017 Recruiting Class, so far...
15. UF - 15 -- 0 - 11 - 3 - 0 -- 7 ESPN Top 300's
#3 TE-H Gamble ****
#10 TE-Y Byrd ****
#12 DE Carter ****
#13 WR Green ****
#15 QB-PP Allen ****
#23 CB Wilson ****
#24 CB Davis ****
#26 Ath Toney **** (RB/DB)
#31 OT Telfort ****

All of these guys could easily be 4 stars.
~ 1 JuCo DT Edwards 6-3 345
#37 OLB Houston 6-1 226 ***
#42 OLB Miller 6-0 227 ***
#74 RB Malik Davis 5 11 185 4.5/40 *** (way under-rated imo) holds 24 D-1 offers.
Malik is the Hillsbouough Co. (Tampa) all time career rushing record holder.
Sr - 2,130 yds, 12.3 ypc, 31 TD's.
HS Career Stats: 6,690 yds, 8.5 ypc, 81 TD's
Others may disagree, but I'm betting a Top 10 class by NSD.

Talking about what this class is missing before NSD is just STUPID! <<<

2016 Recruiting Class

UF - 25 -- 0 - 15 - 9 - 1 -- 7 ESPN Top 300's
#1 RB Thompson **** JuCo
#2 DE Clayton **** (a 5 star imo)
#4 WR Cleveland ****
#4 SS/CB Gardener ****
#5 QB-PP Franks ****
#6 WR-slot Massey **** JuCo -- ACL in Aug
#16 WR Hammond ****
#17 OLB Joseph ****
#21 FS Lenton ****
#24 OLB Moon ****
#29 WR Swain ****
#29 DE Smith ****
#30 RB Perine ****
#47 DE Polite ****
#61 WR Wells ****

Several Under-rated 3 Stars
#1 K Pineiro *** - rsSo 1st year starter, 3/3 over 50 yds.
#8 OC Heggie *** - Injured his Sr year, redshirting
#26 ILB Reese - starter tFr ILB, leading Tkl's last 2 games.
#34 QB-PP - Trask - should be starting imoho
#39 S Jeawon Taylor *** playing on ST's
#46 OG Jawaan Taylor - starter tFr at RT
#81 CB McWilliams - injured, redshirt
#89 OT Forsythe - redshirt
CB Putu - JuCo playing on ST's

2015 Recruiting Class (only 2 months to recruit)

UF 21 -- 2 - 6 - 13 - 9 -- 6 ESPN Top 300's
#1 OT/OG Ivey ***** - 2 year starter
#2 DE Jefferson ***** - player and/or started both years
#3 OC/OG Jordan **** - starter
#7 TE Knight ****
#13 RB Scarlett **** - played, now primary starter
#21 Ath McGriff **** - lost to academics, JuCo, intends to return
#33 WR Callaway **** - starter
#29 Ath Cronkrite **** - RB plays in committee

3 Stars, many seeing playing time.
#45 DE/DT Zuniga *** - way underrated
#62 OLB Rayshad Jackson ***
#79 DT/OG Desir-Jones *** -
#80 SS Johnson *** - now a starting LB
#105 OG Buchanan ***
#138 DE Davis *** - playing
#148 DE Ancrum *** - seeing playing time
#155 OT Johnson *** - Fr starter at RT, now starting RG

3 are 5 stars by my count, with 31 that are 4 stars.
That's already 34 that are 4-5 stars, with the 2017 class not yet complete.
With 99% of the 2016 offense already coming from those players.
The missing QB is the missing piece to a quality offense, and he might already be on the roster (Franks or Trask).
Someone wanted a QB-DT. Well, Trask is 6-4 238 4.6/40 so I'm guessing that he could fit that bill quite well.

 

[Dannygator1989]

2017 Recruiting Class, so far...
15. UF - 15 -- 0 - 11 - 3 - 0 -- 7 ESPN Top 300's
#3 TE-H Gamble ****
#10 TE-Y Byrd ****
#12 DE Carter ****
#13 WR Green ****
#15 QB-PP Allen ****
#23 CB Wilson ****
#24 CB Davis ****
#26 Ath Toney **** (RB/DB)
#31 OT Telfort ****

All of these guys could easily be 4 stars.
~ 1 JuCo DT Edwards 6-3 345
#37 OLB Houston 6-1 226 ***
#42 OLB Miller 6-0 227 ***
#74 RB Malik Davis 5 11 185 4.5/40 *** (way under-rated imo) holds 24 D-1 offers.
Malik is the Hillsbouough Co. (Tampa) all time career rushing record holder.
Sr - 2,130 yds, 12.3 ypc, 31 TD's.
HS Career Stats: 6,690 yds, 8.5 ypc, 81 TD's
Others may disagree, but I'm betting a Top 10 class by NSD.

Talking about what this class is missing before NSD is just STUPID! <<<

2016 Recruiting Class

UF - 25 -- 0 - 15 - 9 - 1 -- 7 ESPN Top 300's
#1 RB Thompson **** JuCo
#2 DE Clayton **** (a 5 star imo)
#4 WR Cleveland ****
#4 SS/CB Gardener ****
#5 QB-PP Franks ****
#6 WR-slot Massey **** JuCo -- ACL in Aug
#16 WR Hammond ****
#17 OLB Joseph ****
#21 FS Lenton ****
#24 OLB Moon ****
#29 WR Swain ****
#29 DE Smith ****
#30 RB Perine ****
#47 DE Polite ****
#61 WR Wells ****

Several Under-rated 3 Stars
#1 K Pineiro *** - rsSo 1st year starter, 3/3 over 50 yds.
#8 OC Heggie *** - Injured his Sr year, redshirting
#26 ILB Reese - starter tFr ILB, leading Tkl's last 2 games.
#34 QB-PP - Trask - should be starting imoho
#39 S Jeawon Taylor *** playing on ST's
#46 OG Jawaan Taylor - starter tFr at RT
#81 CB McWilliams - injured, redshirt
#89 OT Forsythe - redshirt
CB Putu - JuCo playing on ST's

2015 Recruiting Class (only 2 months to recruit)

UF 21 -- 2 - 6 - 13 - 9 -- 6 ESPN Top 300's
#1 OT/OG Ivey ***** - 2 year starter
#2 DE Jefferson ***** - player and/or started both years
#3 OC/OG Jordan **** - starter
#7 TE Knight ****
#13 RB Scarlett **** - played, now primary starter
#21 Ath McGriff **** - lost to academics, JuCo, intends to return
#33 WR Callaway **** - starter
#29 Ath Cronkrite **** - RB plays in committee

3 Stars, many seeing playing time.
#45 DE/DT Zuniga *** - way underrated
#62 OLB Rayshad Jackson ***
#79 DT/OG Desir-Jones *** -
#80 SS Johnson *** - now a starting LB
#105 OG Buchanan ***
#138 DE Davis *** - playing
#148 DE Ancrum *** - seeing playing time
#155 OT Johnson *** - Fr starter at RT, now starting RG

3 are 5 stars by my count, with 31 that are 4 stars.
That's already 34 that are 4-5 stars, with the 2017 class not yet complete.
With 99% of the 2016 offense already coming from those players.
The missing QB is the missing piece to a quality offense, and he might already be on the roster (Franks or Trask).
Someone wanted a QB-DT. Well, Trask is 6-4 238 4.6/40 so I'm guessing that he could fit that bill quite well.

Rob Gronkowski is about 6'7" and 250

Why doesn't he start over Tom Brady?

 

[MJWilliamson]

The recruiting pitch has to be; "Want to play right away? Want to help us turn the offense around so we can win an SEC title? We're close, we are right there. You could make the difference."

 

[instaGATOR]

Rob Gronkowski is about 6'7" and 250

Why doesn't he start over Tom Brady?

Yet another prefect example of your dunny-crap excuse for a brain.
Stupid people like you are like glow sticks.
I want to snap them & shake the chit outta them,
until the lite finally comes on....

However, shaking the chit of the dunny would leave nothing but his clothes and another smelly mess for someone to have to clean up...

 

[Michi-Gator]

Rob Gronkowski is about 6'7" and 250

Why doesn't he start over Tom Brady?

So Franks passed Trask and Mac is looking at some other transfers and LDR will be back. I think my boy Insta is going to be a sad dude soon.

 

[Gator Fever]

So Franks passed Trask and Mac is looking at some other transfers and LDR will be back. I think my boy Insta is going to be a sad dude soon.

Hopefully he starts LDR against Bama to witness that so he can get any thoughts of starting LDR next year out of his head.

 

[Dannygator1989]

Yet another prefect example of your dunny-crap excuse for a brain.
Stupid people like you are like glow sticks.
I want to snap them & shake the chit outta them,
until the lite finally comes on....

However, shaking the chit of the dunny would leave nothing but his clothes and another smelly mess for someone to have to clean up...

My argument is as valid as yours.

You love the size of Trask, saw him for a few minutes in the spring game, and oddly hang your hat on Doug Nussmeiers opinion.

You have no better argument.

 

[instaGATOR]

My argument is as valid as yours.

You love the size of Trask, saw him for a few minutes in the spring game, and oddly hang your hat on Doug Nussmeiers opinion.

You have no better argument.

That's all you know about it, and I'm not at all surprised by that either.
But at least you admit that my argument is valid, while I think your's is FoS as usual. There is volumes of information out there about Trask, if you're not to lazy/sorry to go find it.

Now please go back to your stalking harassment of Michi, I'm tired of your usual chit for tonight.

 

[instaGATOR]

So Franks passed Trask and Mac is looking at some other transfers and LDR will be back. I think my boy Insta is going to be a sad dude soon.

He started LDR and Happyby this year instead of Trask or Franks, so which one of us is sad, now that the results of that are out there to be seen by anyone.

BTW, the first time Spurrier was out at practice, he looked over the QB's an said that the thought that Trask looked pretty good. Then he was quickly informed that LDR was the 'chosen-one' and so he never said another word about it from then on, at least not out in public anyway.

And I'm not your boy, but I've got YOUR boy swingin' bubba.

 

[saenole]

Are everybody's 3-star recruits underrated? I know ours always seem to be.

Florida has always had good talent on campus, and it won't take much to get yourself out of the offensive hole you've been in. Finding a serviceable QB would be a big step in the right direction...a quick-thinking, mobile guy can cover for a lot of OL woes.

I have lots of Gators in my family, and I honestly hope you guys find a way to take Alabama down this Saturday. It would be fun to watch the resulting talking-head meltdown.

 

[DLinOrlando]

That's all you know about it, and I'm not at all surprised by that either.
But at least you admit that my argument is valid, while I think your's is FoS as usual. There is volumes of information out there about Trask, if you're not to lazy/sorry to go find it.

Now please go back to your stalking harassment of Michi, I'm tired of your usual chit for tonight.

You and Danny are like a soap opera - I leave for years and come back and nothing has changed. What's your secret for making it last??

 

[Dannygator1989]

You and Danny are like a soap opera - I leave for years and come back and nothing has changed. What's your secret for making it last??

Opposites attract.

I still find perverse pleasure in watching him run around in logical circles?

There's a chance his circuit board malfunctions and he dies?

 

[oozie7]

LOL

 

[Gator Fever]

Whatever happened to compugator? His posts were a little different at times.

 

[bradleygator]

Whatever happened to compugator? His posts were a little different at times.

I was just thinking about that. He and Danny had a pretty good rapport going.

 

[Gator Fever]

I was just thinking about that. He and Danny had a pretty good rapport going.

I wonder if him and insta ever had a back and forth?

 

[Dannygator1989]

I'm of the belief that insta and compu has the same ending as Fight Club.

 

[invisiblegator]

I'm giving it next year. If we don't see improvement on the Oline and at QB, then I'm done. I think having a decent QB will make a difference. I think that Nuss is on the hotseat right now. I have been pessimistic about us but if by year 3 we don't have a top 50 offense and the defense stays around the same, then I think we know what to do.

 

[sadgator]

What makes anybody think we are actually going to change OC? No sign or talk of that from Mac. sadgator will not be surprised at all if there is no OC change this off season.

 

[djegators]

Obviously there are recruiting issues....but we already knew that from last year....that class was supposed to be the big one, the one the coach get entering his second season....was a nice class, filled some needs, but not spectacular, and there is no indication that this staff excels at attracting top players in state, that they are excellent at talent eval, and that they can develop the talent.

 

[instaGATOR]

Like dunny-goater admitted to, he's a stalking A-hole with little of value to add to any thread. Those who enjoy what he does are mostly brain-dead imo. I avoid him whenever possible, but avoiding a stalker is not the stalked's option, so I just slap his face red whenever he starts his usual chit with me. I have enjoyed a slight repast this past week as he centered his unwanted attentions on poor michi.
=========

McElwain is 18-7 over 2 season so far, with two canceled it should be 20-7.
He is also a sterling 13-3 vs SEC, and he went 5-0 in the SWAMP in 2016.
That's also playing through 4 different QB's, and massive team wide injuries. Valid reasons are not excuses.

UF is a 22 pt dog in the SEC-C game, but then UK just beat UL and Vandy just beat Tenn didn't they? So while I don't expect it to happen,,, on any Saturday in the SEC....
Oh BTW, the SEC-C QB depth chart lists in Alphabetical order at backup: Franks OR Trask.

1992 - 2016 = 25 Years. UF will have played in 12 (SEC Record) of them, for almost half. Not too bad for a school with no 'history or traditions' I'd say.
UF will have played Bama in 9 of them, going 4-4 with them so far. This will be Bama's 1st chance to take the lead over UF since winning the 1st one in 1992. UF has led the way over Bama since 1993.
Note: It has cost Bama a $fortune$, to finally buy their way back to this point.

"There's a lot of the same base principles,'' McElwain said of Alabama's offense. "There's more quarterback (tFr Hurts) run, read-option type things, obviously, taking advantage of the unique skills-set that this guy has. He's fun to watch, I'm telling you. He's got great command. He's calm. He doesn't get flustered. He takes what they give him. Yet, they give him a crack, he can beat you with his feet."

That sounds a lot like what the Gator's might have had with Trask in the Game from the get-go. My one diss on Mc-Nuss is for not having either the nerve, or maybe the foresight, to have taken the risk of going all out with Trask starting with the Spring game. Never know how things might have worked out.
They instead seem to have made what they considered to be the 'SAFE' choice at QB. BOOM!
But I still like the coaching staff, to a man, even the flailing around OC. He too might deserve a bit of a break during this rebuilding process.

"We're getting a lot of really good things going on as far as commitment to the facilities, the things we need to do,'' Mc said Monday. "That's not for me. That's for the sustainability of the University of Florida football program and its brand. We've been behind but we're catching up. I know that's something that is making a lot of people nervous around the country, and that's a good thing."

Now nay-sayers, be careful what you wish for, because in a Tuesday morning article by Dan Wolken of USA-Today Sports:
"There are whispers that Florida’s Jim McElwain could be intrigued by the opportunity to return to the Pacific Northwest (Ore), close to where he went to college and started his coaching career at Eastern Washington. Despite winning SEC East titles in his first two years, McElwain has been a bit under-appreciated by the Florida fan base and just got a new athletics director in Gainesville."
~ McElwain is the first coach in SEC history to take his team to the SEC title game in his first two seasons at the school.

Now the critical question becomes; who is available, amenable to take this constant 'hot seat' job, and is willing to come in to put up with what some Gator fans are so fond of dishing out to a new HC?

 

[instaGATOR]

I'm glad that the Mc's leaving bs is over with. Moving right along....

After the 2015 season, UF sent 1st round Jr DB's to the NLF, VH3 and Neal.
Again, UF is sending 2 likely 1st round Jr's to the NFL, Tabor & Wilson.
And then there's rsSr AA safety Marcus Maye rsSr, also to the NFL.
So the Gators will have nobody to play in the secondary for 2017, they're doomed!

DB-U,,, with the deepest class of secondary recruits (2017) in school history? Maybe?

S/Nic Nick Washington rsSr 6-0 197
S Marcell Harris Sr 6-1 211
S Quincey Lenton So 5-11 202
CB/S Joseph Putu Sr 6-2 195
CB/Nic Duke Dawson Sr 5-10 208
CB Chris Williamson Jr 5-11 191
CB/S Chauncey Gardener So 5-11 204
CB Jeawon Taylor So 6-0 187
CB C.J. McWilliams rsFr? 5-11 171
CB McAuthor Burnett rsFr? 5-9 174
Many of those 10 DB's can play any of the secondary positions.
-----
What keeps me from worring about it much is position coach, Torrian Gray.
That, and these quality 2017 DB Recruit Commits:
#23 CB Marco Wilson 6-0 185 ****
#24 CB Shawn Davis 6-1 195 ****
#25 CB Elijah Blades 6-3 170 ****
#26 Ath Kadarius Toney 6-0 185 **** (CB/RB?)

Other DB Possibilities: These 3 are scheduled to officially visit UF.
CB Shawn Wade ***** -- from Jax - tOSU commit.
CB C.J. Henderson **** - from Miami
CB Brad Stewart **** - from New Orleans
------
UF is also in position to flip Auburn QB commit Tray Bishop (Dawson, Ga.), a 4-star Ath and U.S. Army AA who wants to play safety in college. Also possible are 4-star safeties Devon Hunter (Chesapeake, Va.) and Xavier McKinney (Roswell, Ga.), with official visits to come. So no-worries-mates....