Academic Comparison of UF, UGA, UM, FSU, & UCF plus entire SEC East

Jeff from Jax · Feb 15, 2019

PlutoDroid · Feb 15, 2019

Florida has a higher tuition rate for out of staters ,but lower for in staters than Florida State. Translation :University of Florida cares more for Floridians.

hardliner · Feb 15, 2019

UM is a private school for rich kids from New Jersey. Take them out and put UCF or USF in.

Jeff from Jax · Feb 17, 2019

hardliner said:
UM is a private school for rich kids from New Jersey. Take them out and put UCF or USF in.

Out of respect for their football national championship, I have added the Univ of Central Florida Golden Knights (#165 Ranking in National Universities) to my academic comparison. Have also formatted the info a little better.

Uniformed_ReRe · Feb 17, 2019

#165?

UCF fans should use that ranking to argue that they would fit right into the SEC.

LakerGator · Feb 17, 2019

Jeff from Jax said:
|...................| |...Gators......| |...Puppies...| |...Canes....| |.School Out West.| |Univ Central Fl |
|U.S. News..| |...Public......| |...Public......| |...Private....| |......Public.............| |....Public...|
| Ranking ... | |#35 in Nat | |#46 in Nat...| |#53 in Nat..| |.....#70 in Nat .......| |.#165 in Nat..|
|...................| | Universities| |Universities| |Universities| |...Universities........| |..Universities..|

|Fall 2017....| |......42.0 %| |....54.0 % | |....36.0 % ...| |.......49.0 %...........| |.......50.0 %...|
|acceptance|
|....rate.........|

|...4-year.....| |...68.0 % ...| |...63.0 %...| |...72.0 %.... | |...63.0 %...............| |.......40.0 %..|
|graduation|
|....rate........|

Information from

https://www.usnews.com/best-college...alk_id=134130&xwalk_id=139959&xwalk_id=132903

Sigh, I’m reading this and watching the Golf, you can tell it’s not football season anymore...

Jeff from Jax · Feb 18, 2019

Actually, according to U S News & World Report college comparison, here are the SEC East rankings -

https://www.usnews.com/best-college...alk_id=218663&xwalk_id=178396&xwalk_id=221999

School ................................National Rank
VU Vanderbilt ..........................14
UF Gators ................................35
UGA Dawgs .............................46
USC Gamecocks ....................106
UT Volunteers .........................115
UM Tigers ...............................129
UK Wildcats ............................147

Sadly, UGA being established so long ago (January 27, 1785, Athens, GA) has given them time to do a few things right academically. To compare, Vanderbilt founded in 1873 and UF in 1905.

Didn't check founding dates, but no other SEC East members even close to these three in rankings !

GatorGray · Feb 20, 2019

I guess he shouldn't have thrown that national championship parade.

UCF president resigns amid investigations into millions in misspending.

Uniformed_ReRe · Feb 20, 2019

GatorGray said:
I guess he shouldn't have thrown that national championship parade.

UCF president resigns amid investigations into millions in misspending.

That’s nuts.

Incidentally (or not), he could be regarded as the third UCF president in a row to be forced to resign. The previous president, Hitt, just resigned from his paid advisor role because of the same scandal. The president before Hitt had to resign after being caught paying hookers with school money.

grommit · Feb 22, 2019

Would just like to toss out that UF is the only university in the SEC, other than Vandy and ATM, that is in the AAU and that is major. We are currently the #8 public university in the country. Just yesterday morning we hit another milestone here in our dept and are now the front runners for the new NSF research grant which will allow us to expand our compute facilities and possibly upgrade our supercomputer which is already the fastest in the state of Florida as well as the entire SEC.

HiperGator 1 and 2 provide the university with over 800 million in research revenue annually settings us as the top research university in both the state as well as The SEC. That amount is about to go up bigtime with what what we've been trying to do to win this NSF grant and as I stated, the directive yesterday morning from the CIO pretty much has set us a green light to proceed so it looks like we are heads and shoulders the leader for that.

For those that don't know, our compute facilities at ECDC here are the main reason we have risen to be the 8th best university in the country and have our eyes on the top 5. Over 100 different universities and research organizations use our UF compute network to facilitate their studies and research and that pulls in the money. In the USA, currently only Texas and Purdue supersede us and only because they didn't pay for their facilities, they are gifted from Dell so there is no limit to what they can put in place.

NorthJerseyGator · Feb 22, 2019

grommit said:
Would just like to toss out that UF is the only university in the SEC, other than Vandy and ATM, that is in the AAU and that is major. We are currently the #8 public university in the country. Just yesterday morning we hit another milestone here in our dept and are now the front runners for the new NSF research grant which will allow us to expand our compute facilities and possibly upgrade our supercomputer which is already the fastest in the state of Florida as well as the entire SEC.

HiperGator 1 and 2 provide the university with over 800 million in research revenue annually settings us as the top research university in both the state as well as The SEC. That amount is about to go up bigtime with what what we've been trying to do to win this NSF grant and as I stated, the directive yesterday morning from the CIO pretty much has set us a green light to proceed so it looks like we are heads and shoulders the leader for that.

For those that don't know, our compute facilities at ECDC here are the main reason we have risen to be the 8th best university in the country and have our eyes on the top 5. Over 100 different universities and research organizations use our UF compute network to facilitate their studies and research and that pulls in the money. In the USA, currently only Texas and Purdue supersede us and only because they didn't pay for their facilities, they are gifted from Dell so there is no limit to what they can put in place.

Mizzou is in the AAU, at least they were a few years ago.

NorthJerseyGator · Feb 22, 2019

Jeff from Jax said:
Actually, according to U S News & World Report college comparison, here are the SEC East rankings -

https://www.usnews.com/best-college...alk_id=218663&xwalk_id=178396&xwalk_id=221999

School ................................National Rank
VU Vanderbilt ..........................14
UF Gators ................................35
UGA Dawgs .............................46
USC Gamecocks ....................106
UT Volunteers .........................115
UM Tigers ...............................129
UK Wildcats ............................147

Sadly, UGA being established so long ago (January 27, 1785, Athens, GA) has given them time to do a few things right academically. To compare, Vanderbilt founded in 1873 and UF in 1905.

Didn't check founding dates, but no other SEC East members even close to these three in rankings !

UF was founded in 1853. That year is everywhere on UF related info, websites, brochures, etc. Perhaps 1905 is when "University of Florida" in it's more modern shape came about.

grommit · Feb 22, 2019

NorthJerseyGator said:
Mizzou is in the AAU, at least they were a few years ago.

Huh I suppose you are correct sir. Seems we made a major upgrade when we invited ATM and Missouri to join the SEC. We doubled the number of academic universities in the conference just by doing that.

NorthJerseyGator · Feb 22, 2019

ukalum1988 said:
Hate to see UK (officially chartered in 1865) rated so low, but Kentucky isn't exactly a prosperous state, and has historically struggled to properly fund higher education. Nevertheless I worked hard for my Chemical Engineering degree and I'm proud to be a Ky native and a UK alum.

School rankings are a supply and demand popularity contest. There are smart students and great educations to be had at all flagship state public universities. Nobody chooses what State they are born into or what family (rich, middle, poor) they are born into so the smart kids in each State from middle and poor families will tend to go to the best in-state school they get accepted to, which means every flagship State public school in every State has tons of smart kids, regardless of what each State school's academic rankings are. Smart kids from rich families don't have to factor in cost when they choose where to go so going out of state public or going private is more an option for them.

Besides, an engineering degree from any State school is way better than most degrees from any school, public or private, regardless of the academic rankings.

There are smart kids everywhere, especially in the hard science majors, regardless of academic rankings!

NorthJerseyGator · Feb 22, 2019

grommit said:
Huh I suppose you are correct sir. Seems we made a major upgrade when we invited ATM and Missouri to join the SEC. We doubled the number of academic universities in the conference just by doing that.

Yeah, I remember it being noted about that when they came to the SEC. Funny thing at the time was Big 10 acts all superior like they only accept AAU when admitting new schools but like a few months after Nebraska joined the Big 10, they actually lost their AAU membership, lol, and I think they still haven't gotten it back. Meanwhile, both schools the SEC took had no quandaries with their AAU membership, haha.

grommit · Feb 22, 2019

NorthJerseyGator said:
School rankings are a supply and demand popularity contest. There are smart students and great educations to be had at all flagship state public universities. Nobody chooses what State they are born into or what family (rich, middle, poor) they are born into so the smart kids in each State from middle and poor families will tend to go to the best in-state school they get accepted to, which means every flagship State public school in every State has tons of smart kids, regardless of what each State school's academic rankings are. Smart kids from rich families don't have to factor in cost when they choose where to go so going out of state public or going private is more an option for them.

Besides, an engineering degree from any State school is way better than most degrees from any school, public or private, regardless of the academic rankings.

There are smart kids everywhere, especially in the hard science majors, regardless of academic rankings!

While this is not untrue, basically we are talking about prestige here, and in this business, success breeds success.

Being able to tell boosters that we have risen another 3 spots in the national rankings helps loosen their wallets and purses to donate to the university to help fund better facilities and projects, and those high rankings help attract the top % students from around the globe as well.

Without those facilities and the qualified people in place, we don't get to compete for valuable things such as the NSF research grant. This is not a popularity contest based on which school has the highest ratings on rate-my-professor here or student satisfaction percentages of the night life, this is the real academic work behind the scenes that makes a school one of the top places to study in the world, or not.

grommit · Feb 22, 2019

NorthJerseyGator said:
Yeah, I remember it being noted about that when they came to the SEC. Funny thing at the time was Big 10 acts all superior like they only accept AAU when admitting new schools but like a few months after Nebraska joined the Big 10, they actually lost their AAU membership, lol, and I think they still haven't gotten it back. Meanwhile, both schools the SEC took had no quandaries with their AAU membership, haha.

Not to stick up for Nebraska, but as I am aware of it, they lost their membership because much of their research is funded by the USDA in beef and field crops research. There was a shift away from that as judged by the AAU members towards pure research or some such. It had to do with the fact that 80% or so of Nebraska's research is funded by the USDA and the AAU wasn't going to count that as research going forwards, so it was really a move to get rid of the farm boys but I feel very unfair towards NU.

grommit · Feb 22, 2019

Can I also point out that the OP's list he made, not to be critical of it, but acceptance rates is a bit of a stupid statistic. It says for 2017 at least, that UCF had a 50% acceptance rate while UF had a 42%. Not to be crapping on them, but UCF is closer to a community college in the idea that if you are QUALIFIED to really be in college, you will get accepted there. UF on the other hand is getting more and more demanding every year. That said, most students know they cannot qualify to get into UF so will not bother to apply. That 42% statistic is based on all those who applied. When I was way back when getting ready to choose my university to study at, I COULD have applied at Harvard, Yale, Stanford and so forth. I knew I didn't have the money and most likely wouldn't be accepted by at least half of those schools anyways. So I never applied to them. Does that count towards their acceptance rate being more selective? No it doesn't.

Perhaps I just did it wrong though and maybe folks just apply everywhere these days and then choose from the list of schools they got accepted to. Back in the early 90's it seemed you chose your one school you'd get accepted to and possibly 2 or 3 others just to see if you could make it in. I never heard of these carpetbomb application tactics that some folks use these days. I still hold that the vast majority of students aren't going to apply to UF if they know they have no chance whatsoever and will end up at UCF or a community college instead.

Graduation rates on the other hand are VERY telling about a university's program and how it guides it's students along the path to earning their education and degrees.

Canes-Rule · Feb 23, 2019

So the University of Miami has the lower acceptance rate, better student-faculty ratio, higher graduation rate, higher average annual salary after graduation....sounds about right.

CountyGator2 · Feb 23, 2019

Canes-Rule said:
So the University of Miami has the lower acceptance rate, better student-faculty ratio, higher graduation rate, higher average annual salary after graduation....sounds about right.

Smaller sample size which skews those metrics. Being private certainly has it's advantages. Surprised UM isn't ranked ahead of UF overall considering all those factors....

NorthJerseyGator · Feb 23, 2019

Canes-Rule said:
So the University of Miami has the lower acceptance rate, better student-faculty ratio, higher graduation rate, higher average annual salary after graduation....sounds about right.

UM has a large ratio of students from Northeast and from South Florida, both areas with higher cost of living and ergo higher offered salaries than other parts of Florida and the Southeast, where a larger ratio of UF's students come from, relative to UM's. Not to mention the much larger volume and band of students and offered salaries at UF.

Uniformed_ReRe · Feb 23, 2019

Acceptance rate doesn’t mean much by itself. Some schools get a large number of unqualified applicants because the school just happens to be in or near a large city and is seemingly convenient. You have to look at the enrolled freshman class statistics to get an idea of how selective a school is.

Uniformed_ReRe · Feb 23, 2019

The B1G makes a big deal out of AAU status, but they’ve been trying to get Notre Dame (non-AAU) to join forever.

AAU status is more about research expenditures than academics, which are inevitably driven by politics and connections.

Jeff from Jax · Feb 23, 2019

NorthJerseyGator said:
UF was founded in 1853. That year is everywhere on UF related info, websites, brochures, etc.
Perhaps 1905 is when "University of Florida" in it's more modern shape came about.

North Jersey Gator

The Map is NOT the Territory !

UF's claim that it was founded in 1853 is erroneous.

The East Florida Seminary, located in Ocala, opened in 1853, becoming the first state-supported institution of higher learning in the state of Florida.
The East Florida Seminary operated in Ocala until the outbreak of the American Civil War in 1861. It closed for the duration of the war, and reopened in Gainesville in 1866, absorbing the Gainesville Academy.

In 1905 - the date I gave for the founding of UF, the Florida legislature passed the Buckman Act, which reorganized the State University System of Florida and empowered the Florida Board of Control to govern the system. The act, named for legislator Henry Holland Buckman, mandated the consolidation of the state's six institutions into three: one for African Americans, one for white women, and one for white men.

It merged the East Florida Seminary, the Florida Agricultural College at Lake City (est. 1884) the St. Petersburg Normal and Industrial School in St. Petersburg, and the South Florida Military College in Bartow – into the University of the State of Florida.

The University of Florida, in an attempt to enhance its academic pedigree, now claims its founding date as 1853.

Sources for UF official history
https://web.archive.org/web/20090622031258/http://www.ufl.edu/history/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_University_of_Florida

Academic one-upmanship is incredible or administration at FSU is really stupid. FSU - did not even wait for classes to start at the West Florida Seminary in Tallahassee.

In 1856 City of Tallahassee petitions the Florida Legislature for the institution west of the Suwannee be located in that city. Legislature accepted because of Tallahassee's railway connections, its "salubrious climate," and its "intelligent, refined, and moral community LOL."

F$U is so desperate to keep up with UF that it now claims the Legislative Act of January 24, 1851, which authorized both seminaries, as its founding date.

The West Florida Seminary did not actually start classes until February 7, 1857, when the first meeting of the Board of Education of the State Seminary West of the Suwannee River was held, and the institution began offering postsecondary instruction to male students.

Derivation of SOW (School Out West) - State Seminary West of the Suwannee River !

FSU history - https://www.fsu.edu/about/history.html

Love the Gators, but don't need to twist history - leave that to F$U!

Uniformed_ReRe · Feb 23, 2019

FSU didn’t go co-ed until after WW2, when they basically ran out of room in Gainesville and had to revamp the Florida State College for Women to handle the huge surge the student veterans who had earn GI Bill paid tuition.

Uniformed_ReRe · Feb 23, 2019

Most schools fudge their founding dates to look more prestigious. In most cases the date goes back to some tiny “normal school” (teacher’s college) or a small agricultural training school, or some parochial bible school,

NorthJerseyGator · Feb 23, 2019

Jeff from Jax said:
North Jersey Gator

The Map is NOT the Territory !

UF's claim that it was founded in 1853 is erroneous.

The East Florida Seminary, located in Ocala, opened in 1853, becoming the first state-supported institution of higher learning in the state of Florida.
The East Florida Seminary operated in Ocala until the outbreak of the American Civil War in 1861. It closed for the duration of the war, and reopened in Gainesville in 1866, absorbing the Gainesville Academy.

In 1905 - the date I gave for the founding of UF, the Florida legislature passed the Buckman Act, which reorganized the State University System of Florida and empowered the Florida Board of Control to govern the system. The act, named for legislator Henry Holland Buckman, mandated the consolidation of the state's six institutions into three: one for African Americans, one for white women, and one for white men.

It merged the East Florida Seminary, the Florida Agricultural College at Lake City (est. 1884) the St. Petersburg Normal and Industrial School in St. Petersburg, and the South Florida Military College in Bartow – into the University of the State of Florida.

The University of Florida, in an attempt to enhance its academic pedigree, now claims its founding date as 1853.

Sources for UF official history
https://web.archive.org/web/20090622031258/http://www.ufl.edu/history/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_University_of_Florida

Academic one-upmanship is incredible or administration at FSU is really stupid. FSU - did not even wait for classes to start at the West Florida Seminary in Tallahassee.

In 1856 City of Tallahassee petitions the Florida Legislature for the institution west of the Suwannee be located in that city. Legislature accepted because of Tallahassee's railway connections, its "salubrious climate," and its "intelligent, refined, and moral community LOL."

F$U is so desperate to keep up with UF that it now claims the Legislative Act of January 24, 1851, which authorized both seminaries, as its founding date.

The West Florida Seminary did not actually start classes until February 7, 1857, when the first meeting of the Board of Education of the State Seminary West of the Suwannee River was held, and the institution began offering postsecondary instruction to male students.

Derivation of SOW (School Out West) - State Seminary West of the Suwannee River !

FSU history - https://www.fsu.edu/about/history.html

Love the Gators, but don't need to twist history - leave that to F$U!

Dayum.....and now I know more than I did yday. Good stuff J from J!

grommit · Mar 1, 2019

Jeff from Jax said:
North Jersey Gator

The Map is NOT the Territory !

UF's claim that it was founded in 1853 is erroneous.

The East Florida Seminary, located in Ocala, opened in 1853, becoming the first state-supported institution of higher learning in the state of Florida.
The East Florida Seminary operated in Ocala until the outbreak of the American Civil War in 1861. It closed for the duration of the war, and reopened in Gainesville in 1866, absorbing the Gainesville Academy.

In 1905 - the date I gave for the founding of UF, the Florida legislature passed the Buckman Act, which reorganized the State University System of Florida and empowered the Florida Board of Control to govern the system. The act, named for legislator Henry Holland Buckman, mandated the consolidation of the state's six institutions into three: one for African Americans, one for white women, and one for white men.

It merged the East Florida Seminary, the Florida Agricultural College at Lake City (est. 1884) the St. Petersburg Normal and Industrial School in St. Petersburg, and the South Florida Military College in Bartow – into the University of the State of Florida.

The University of Florida, in an attempt to enhance its academic pedigree, now claims its founding date as 1853.

Sources for UF official history
https://web.archive.org/web/20090622031258/http://www.ufl.edu/history/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_University_of_Florida

Academic one-upmanship is incredible or administration at FSU is really stupid. FSU - did not even wait for classes to start at the West Florida Seminary in Tallahassee.

In 1856 City of Tallahassee petitions the Florida Legislature for the institution west of the Suwannee be located in that city. Legislature accepted because of Tallahassee's railway connections, its "salubrious climate," and its "intelligent, refined, and moral community LOL."

F$U is so desperate to keep up with UF that it now claims the Legislative Act of January 24, 1851, which authorized both seminaries, as its founding date.

The West Florida Seminary did not actually start classes until February 7, 1857, when the first meeting of the Board of Education of the State Seminary West of the Suwannee River was held, and the institution began offering postsecondary instruction to male students.

Derivation of SOW (School Out West) - State Seminary West of the Suwannee River !

FSU history - https://www.fsu.edu/about/history.html

Love the Gators, but don't need to twist history - leave that to F$U!

With all due respect, the schools in Florida aren't the only ones doing this. Every school in every state is trying to make itself stand up next to the Ivy league schools that pre-date the American Revolution.

grommit · Mar 1, 2019

Uniformed_ReRe said:
Most schools fudge their founding dates to look more prestigious. In most cases the date goes back to some tiny “normal school” (teacher’s college) or a small agricultural training school, or some parochial bible school,

Look at the University of Georgia. They claim some 1595 founding date or some nonsense, but they have YET to actually get a REAL book at their "campus". Going by their propaganda, they would probably be the oldest university in The SEC, but do they truly qualify as a university when the biggest major there is color by number?

Jeff from Jax · Mar 2, 2019

grommit said:
Look at the University of Georgia. They claim some 1595 founding date or some nonsense, but they have YET to actually get a REAL book at their "campus". Going by their propaganda, they would probably be the oldest university in The SEC, but do they truly qualify as a university when the biggest major there is color by number?

Reminds me of SOS's #1 ranked quote (SI - below) about Auburn's library -
On a fire at the Auburn library that destroyed 20 books: “The real tragedy was that 15 hadn’t been colored yet.”

https://www.si.com/extra-mustard/2017/08/09/steve-spurrier-quotes-insults-best-lines-ranked
https://ftw.usatoday.com/2015/10/steve-spurriers-15-greatest-trash-talking-quotes

Dr. Curmudgeon · Mar 2, 2019

Jeff from Jax said:
Actually, according to U S News & World Report college comparison, here are the SEC East rankings -

https://www.usnews.com/best-college...alk_id=218663&xwalk_id=178396&xwalk_id=221999

School ................................National Rank
VU Vanderbilt ..........................14
UF Gators ................................35
UGA Dawgs .............................46
USC Gamecocks ....................106
UT Volunteers .........................115
UM Tigers ...............................129
UK Wildcats ............................147

Sadly, UGA being established so long ago (January 27, 1785, Athens, GA) has given them time to do a few things right academically. To compare, Vanderbilt founded in 1873 and UF in 1905.

Didn't check founding dates, but no other SEC East members even close to these three in rankings !

Wow, I'm proud of my Vols, they're not in the 200's anymore..

Uniformed_ReRe · Mar 2, 2019

I don't think UT was ever ranked that low. A few years ago, UT and FSU were similarly ranked, but FSU has been climbing the rankings over the last decade.

Academic Comparison of UF, UGA, UM, FSU, & UCF plus entire SEC East

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