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Amazing how cavalier we are about committing to trillions in spending

Hoppo

Bull Gator
Jul 19, 2001
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#teamapplebees
We spend 3.5 trillion dollars a year. Why is it when it takes slightly longer than the average Hollywood movie to ram a 13-digit spending bill through Congress and the White House everyone thinks the system is broken? There should be MORE debate on that level of operation, not less.
 
#1-Easy to spend other peoples money
#2-They will never be held accountable for any of this
 
Of both your points I am aware. What's more remarkable to me is that the people think the process should be even faster than it is.
 
Originally posted by Hoppo:
We spend 3.5 trillion dollars a year. Why is it when it takes slightly longer than the average Hollywood movie to ram a 13-digit spending bill through Congress and the White House everyone thinks the system is broken? There should be MORE debate on that level of operation, not less.

"The agreement does includes backpay for all federal workers who were furloughed during the government shutdown." So all this posturing didn't save any money.

IMO the biggest mistake by the Republicans was focusing on repealing the ACA, which ended up basically unchanged. They should have focused on stuff that stood a better chance of getting implemented, like corporate tax restructuring. But I guess they'll have until January to work those things out. I'm not hopeful.
 
I don't know that it was a mistake. This will likely embolden the Tea Party within the GOP, and could very well even strengthen their numbers in the next set of midterms. They can all point to how they didn't back down, and were sold out by the establishment. This also may get enough support in the House to give Boehner the boot.
 
I know one thing, in spite of the media's best efforts Obama didn't emerge from this unscathed, he has a 38% approval rating. The midterms aren't going to be a republican landslide, but they're going to keep the house as a few of those artificial democrat seats won in the bush era bitch fit are coming up again and they're in traditional GOP areas, this will offset some of their losses. If Obama truly cared about the country and wasn't a blind ideologue he'd negotiate, he won't because he isn't capable of it, the next couple of years are going to be rough on the country.

Fortunately for him the establishment GOP wonks will cave to him, but you're right the days of the big government GOP being able to pander to the religious right and win is over, the constitutional right is rising and that probably concerns both major parties.

I personally don't see a scenario where this doesn't devolve into open warfare at some point, on the one hand I hope I'm wrong, but on the other that's the only way I can see us maintaining any freedoms..........
 
Originally posted by Dr. Nole:

#1-Easy to spend other peoples money
#2-They will never be held accountable for any of this
this^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
 
Originally posted by BigOleNastyGator:
I know one thing, in spite of the media's best efforts Obama didn't emerge from this unscathed, he has a 38% approval rating. The midter. aren't going to be a republican landslide, but they're going to keep the house as a few of those artificial democrat seats won in the bush era bitch fit are coming up again and they're in traditional GOP areas, this will offset some of their losses. If Obama truly cared about the country and wasn't a blind ideologue he'd negotiate, he won't because he isn't capable of it, the next couple of years are going to be rough on the country.

Fortunately for him the establishment GOP wonks will cave to him, but you're right the days of the big government GOP being able to pander to the religious right and win is over, the constitutional right is rising and that probably concerns both major parties.

I personally don't see a scenario where this doesn't devolve into open warfare at some point, on the one hand I hope I'm wrong, but on the other that's the only way I can see us maintaining any freedoms..........

I agree that Obama has been hurt but I think the tea party has taken most of the blame. If this lasted much longer, or pushed the US into default, the Repubs would have been finished. Open warfare? I hope you are not being literal.
 
Originally posted by badselectioncommittee:

Originally posted by BigOleNastyGator:
I know one thing, in spite of the media's best efforts Obama didn't emerge from this unscathed, he has a 38% approval rating. The midter. aren't going to be a republican landslide, but they're going to keep the house as a few of those artificial democrat seats won in the bush era bitch fit are coming up again and they're in traditional GOP areas, this will offset some of their losses. If Obama truly cared about the country and wasn't a blind ideologue he'd negotiate, he won't because he isn't capable of it, the next couple of years are going to be rough on the country.

Fortunately for him the establishment GOP wonks will cave to him, but you're right the days of the big government GOP being able to pander to the religious right and win is over, the constitutional right is rising and that probably concerns both major parties.

I personally don't see a scenario where this doesn't devolve into open warfare at some point, on the one hand I hope I'm wrong, but on the other that's the only way I can see us maintaining any freedoms..........

I agree that Obama has been hurt but I think the tea party has taken most of the blame. If this lasted much longer, or pushed the US into default, the Repubs would have been finished. Open warfare? I hope you are not being literal.
I think you're mistaken, the "tea party" whatever that even is any more, only took the blame in blue states, in red states, ie their electorate they're heroes, Boehner is the villain here. Quite literal, not saying it will happen, but it's all that's left for any hope of a fee society.
 
Originally posted by BigOleNastyGator:

Originally posted by badselectioncommittee:

I agree that Obama has been hurt but I think the tea party has taken most of the blame. If this lasted much longer, or pushed the US into default, the Repubs would have been finished. Open warfare? I hope you are not being literal.
I think you're mistaken, the "tea party" whatever that even is any more, only took the blame in blue states, in red states, ie their electorate they're heroes, Boehner is the villain here. Quite literal, not saying it will happen, but it's all that's left for any hope of a fee society.
This is likely true. The Tea Party wasn't really hurt anywhere it counted. Everyone else was.
 
Yes, true that this has no impact on the bright red or bright blue states. But I have seen more and more "moderate" republicans and democrats upset by the threat of a default, and true or not the tea party is getting most of the blame (obviously both sides are taking much of the heat). Like it or not, you will need the moderates to win any future elections.

Remember when a lot of the moderate democrats were switching over to the Republican party during Reagan? I think you may see the opposite if the Repubs don't get their house in order. If you think the Republican party can survive with only libertarians, tea party types and social conservatives, you are sadly mistaken.
 
Originally posted by badselectioncommittee:
Yes, true that this has no impact on the bright red or bright blue states. But I have seen more and more "moderate" republicans and democrats upset by the threat of a default, and true or not the tea party is getting most of the blame (obviously both sides are taking much of the heat). Like it or not, you will need the moderates to win any future elections.

Remember when a lot of the moderate democrats were switching over to the Republican party during Reagan? I think you may see the opposite if the Repubs don't get their house in order. If you think the Republican party can survive with only libertarians, tea party types and social conservatives, you are sadly mistaken.
First of all, we will never win another election, by we I mean sane educated people. This is the era of the demagogue and the bought congress, there is literally no hope of a sane solution every passing. I don't want the republican party to survive, I would prefer that both it and the democratic party implode.

Look, we have a math problem here, wealth is extracted, resources are extracted, and we've created the mechanism by which it happens, we're attempting to blind the people to it with all these "free" welfare state programs that we can't continue to fund, and raising taxes won't fix the problem, raising taxes will actually lower revenue and further damage business. The problem is we've so saddled the economy with tax and regulation it isn't growing fast enough for the tax base to grow to fund this crap, due to what we've done it never will again.

We have the worst, least productive, least educated, least responsible segment of our population breeding like it's their freaking job, and why not, we do pay them for it, and this will lead to an even worse electorate in the future. There is no hope, things aren't going to get better, and there aren't enough loop holes to save you.

They know it too, look at the whistle blower felony law the most transparent administration ever just signed into law. civil war is the only thing that could save the country at this point, but that isn't going to happen either, we're too fat and happy for that, by the time we're pissed enough to do it, it will already be too late.

In short, moderates are idiots only slightly better than your far left types, they think we can sustain an extra trillion dollars a year of spending indefinitely, or by merely taxing the rich more, which is inane at best.
 
Originally posted by BigOleNastyGator:


In short, moderates are idiots only slightly better than your far left types, they think we can sustain an extra trillion dollars a year of spending indefinitely, or by merely taxing the rich more, which is inane at best.
Hey, I resemble that remark. I think most moderates are fiscally conservative. In fact, if you look at the tea parties platform, I support most of them. I think their problem is more in the delivery, than the substance, which allows the media to paint them as far right crazies. Here is their platform:




Repeal Obamacare; Pursue Patient-Centered CareStop the Tax HikesReverse Obama's Spending IncreasesScrap the Code; Replace It with a Flat TaxPass a Balanced Budget AmendmentReject Cap and TradeRein in the EPAUnleash America's Vast Energy PotentialEliminate the Department of EducationReduce the Bloated Federal WorkforceCurtail Excessive Federal RegulationAudit the Fed
Nothing too radical there, except maybe the concept of a flat tax and eliminating the DOE (most moderates have their doubts about Obamacare also). I think most moderates would support this platform.
 
moderates aren't as important as you think. Due to excessive and irresponsible breeding and our immigration policy the entitlement class is growing at an alarming rate and all they really know is they want MOOOAAAR. They'll vote to get it and politicians will fall over themselves to give it.

There is no longer a viable political solution.
 
Originally posted by BigOleNastyGator:
moderates aren't as important as you think. Due to excessive and irresponsible breeding and our immigration policy the entitlement class is growing at an alarming rate and all they really know is they want MOOOAAAR. They'll vote to get it and politicians will fall over themselves to give it.

There is no longer a viable political solution.
You'd make a bad political stategist. Because our entitlement class is growing as you say, it is even more important for the Repubs to reach out to the independents/moderates IMO. Personally, there is no way I could vote for Hillary in 2016. I'll bet she doesn't poll well with most moderates so don't leave the country quite yet.
 
The threat of Default was a pure BS issue. Simply fiction. Interest on debts = $30 Billion per month. Monthly Revenues = $250 Billion per month. Phony premise, phony arguments, phony issue.

DNC and RNC like to hammer the TPs because it distracts people from the fact that the TPs have never accounted for $1 in debt or deficit.

It is amazing how the game of misdirection is played. And the press goes wild... The profligates DEM/GOP are both happy to blame those who neither created nor support irresponsibility.

Meanwhile, New Pork for all, including 2.9 Billion for Mitch McConnel to bring home to Kentuicky... I wonder which group of his supporters will benefits from contracts with that $$$$ ?
dead.r191677.gif
In short, Mitch got paid!
 
Originally posted by badselectioncommittee:
Originally posted by BigOleNastyGator:
moderates aren't as important as you think. Due to excessive and irresponsible breeding and our immigration policy the entitlement class is growing at an alarming rate and all they really know is they want MOOOAAAR. They'll vote to get it and politicians will fall over themselves to give it.

There is no longer a viable political solution.
You'd make a bad political stategist. Because our entitlement class is growing as you say, it is even more important for the Repubs to reach out to the independents/moderates IMO. Personally, there is no way I could vote for Hillary in 2016. I'll bet she doesn't poll well with most moderates so don't leave the country quite yet.
Moderates are a lie, they're not really moderates in most cases and in any event the growth of the entitlement class is so overwhelming there is nothing short of revolution or secession we could do to save ourselves. It's a sinking ship on a sea of tyranny.
 
Originally posted by Ghost of Spaceheater:
Why do you guys bother talking to baddie? He has the mind of a bureaucrat.
You need to read The Art of War. You need to understand how your enemy thinks before you can defeat him. You obviosly havent learned that lesson.
 
Originally posted by BigOleNastyGator:

Originally posted by badselectioncommittee:
Yes, true that this has no impact on the bright red or bright blue states. But I have seen more and more "moderate" republicans and democrats upset by the threat of a default, and true or not the tea party is getting most of the blame (obviously both sides are taking much of the heat). Like it or not, you will need the moderates to win any future elections.

Remember when a lot of the moderate democrats were switching over to the Republican party during Reagan? I think you may see the opposite if the Repubs don't get their house in order. If you think the Republican party can survive with only libertarians, tea party types and social conservatives, you are sadly mistaken.
First of all, we will never win another election, by we I mean sane educated people. This is the era of the demagogue and the bought congress
And this hasn't been the case since at least the 1850s? At WORST 1870s?

Things like this tend to go in cycles. In the 1880s, no one had even heard of Populists. 40 years later they're prohibiting alcohol and letting women vote.
 
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